What's the point...

[Smithy]

of engine management lights? I know what they are supposed to do but in less sophisticated systems like the mighty Enfield they seem to be worthless. The MIL light as they term it came on three days ago and as all systems are functioning perfectly I am ignoring it. I had the same with my SR400 and took the bulb out of that with no ill effect. The cynic in me says they are a way of getting the less knowledgable person to the garage for work they don't need.

Ian

[iansoady]

I found this on the Hitchcocks site:



"In order for the self diagnostic system to be of any use it must first be deployed. The procedure for that is to find the "test pin" wire and ground it out. This wire is just a short piece of wire from the ECU with a female plug on the end. You can put an alligator clip on it and then ground it. When that is done the MIL will start blinking in code to tell you what has failed. I thought the codes were published in the owners manual but I COULD VERY WELL BE MISTAKEN and I do not have one in front of me. I have posted the codes below however."
 
"You can ground the lead in the right tool box and read the codes by how many times the lights blink when you turn the ignition on."

"On the G5 it's under the seat. Right on the connector that plugs into the ECU.

Here's the codes,
MIL BLINK CONTENT
Engine will start but not perform to its potential. MIL will glow continuous
LONG 0 SHORT 6 Throttle Position Sensor (TPS) circuit malfunctioning
LONG 0 SHORT 9 Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) circuit malfunctioning
LONG 1 SHORT 1 Engine oil Temperature (TE) circuit malfunctioning
LONG 1 SHORT 7 O2 Sensor circuit malfunctioning
LONG 4 SHORT 5 O2 Sensor heater circuit malfunctioning

Engine will NOT Start but will crank. MIL will glow continuous
LONG 1 SHORT 5 Rollover Sensor circuit malfunctioning
LONG 3 SHORT 3 Injector circuit malfunctioning
LONG 3 SHORT 7 Ignition Coil circuit malfunctioning
LONG 4 SHORT 1 Fuel Pump circuit malfunctioning
LONG 6 SHORT 6 Crankshaft position circuit malfunctioning
Testing Procedure using the Test pin in the vehicle."

[Smithy]

Thanks Ian I will have a look at that later. I know the cable that it is referring to and wondered what it was for.

Ian

[Propellor]

Hi Ian.

I downloaded a pdf manual and there is a section devoted to this kind of thing. It has the same text as posted by Ian and a whole lot more. My device will only allow me to e mail it on so I can't seem to link it here. You have my mob so if you'd like me to e mail it let me know your add. If I can remember the web address ill link that here. I've seen the same manual available in print and ill be buying a copy myself as it is much easier to flip through a book than it is a pdf doc.

Cheers.

Andrew.

[Propellor]

Service manual of the Bullet EFI - Midland Bullet Riders
PDFwww.midlandbullets.co.uk › Workshop ...

Try that. I didn't find it there initially but it seems to be the same one.

Edit: it's not posted as an actual link but it might be enough info for you to find it.

[Propellor]

Pop this into Google

royal enfield service manual pdf free download

[Andy M]

In action on the one I had

https://vimeo.com/234117778

A good system IMHO and way easier than swapping o-rings, shoving wires down jets and trying to get things to seal with WD40 and all the other stuff you have to do with carbs. Blink code and multimeter take you down a more defined path.

Andy

[JOOLZ]

Oh dear bl**dy modern tech, the old way of diagnosis was if the bit that was supposed to be on the inside is now sitting on the outside, you may have a problem

[Smithy]

Many thanks Propellor and Andy I will have a look at what it might be telling me. By the way Joolz the old way still works but only after ignoring the modern tech for long enough!

Ian

[johnr]

i suppose that once youve got the codes then theyre a bit of a boon. back in the pre electronics days when your bike ran like a bag of whitworth spanners, you had to start guessing what the fault might be, and youd have probably laughed if someone had suggested that there might one day be a part on your bike that would tell you in the event of a fault what exactly was wrong even sometimes before you noticed there was a fault. obviously the downside is that nothing is repairable now, so the light just tells you which expensive component you need to replace, but thats thee price of progress im afraid.

[Andy M]

Blink code is old hat I'm afraid.

There is some truth that it doesn't give enough detail and for many faults you then need a diagnostic tool to simulate or stimulate single parts, but when this coincided with locking out anyone who hasn't bought the kit it was too good a chance to miss. The Americans did a great thing by forcing the OBD2 standard. The gutless EU should hang its head in shame in allowing the like of VW and BMW to thwart it world wide. The fact you can talk to German stuff by cutting off their crappy plugs and wiring an OBD on just makes it silly. But this is old hat too.

I can now read fault codes on a fleet of trailers anywhere I have a 4G phone signal. It's coming to other vehicles. How you are sold the data is still under discussion. An app with a monthly fee seems likely. Question then of course is how much.

Andy

[Smithy]

Hang on everyone we're forgetting this is a Royal Enfield and plays by it's own rules. Not only did the bike continue to run faultlessly with the light on but after ignoring it for a couple of weeks it has decided to go off again.

I'm sure that sophisticated systems are invaluable to the professional or the informed but I bought an Enfield so I could mend it using my trusty collection of hammers, both Imperial and Metric so will continue to treat it like the simple machine it is.

Thanks all for the input.

Ian

[Propellor]

Hang on everyone we're forgetting this is a Royal Enfield and plays by it's own rules. Not only did the bike continue to run faultlessly with the light on but after ignoring it for a couple of weeks it has decided to go off again.

I'm sure that sophisticated systems are invaluable to the professional or the informed but I bought an Enfield so I could mend it using my trusty collection of hammers, both Imperial and Metric so will continue to treat it like the simple machine it is.

Thanks all for the input.

Ian

Ha ha. Hear hear.

Can see it now. "Guys, we've got this lot in the palm of our hands, they'll do anything a tech gadget tells em to. We'll program the light to come on after two years so they bring it in for a service. If they ignore it for a couple of weeks we may as well program it to go off again cos they're obviously the type with a trusty collection of hammers". Hee hee. Only joking, although I suspect an element of truth.

[Andy M]

Service lights are only used by a few companies who too daft/arrogant to do the research. They encourage the hackers because the sort of people who are determined not to use the dealers will ignore it or annoy the hackers until they do it. Once the hackers are in they'd be daft not to try and get deeper. The ignored service lights lower resale value and get the brand a reputation for hassle. No one ever thanks you for the reminder, so why do it.

Running with the light on on the Bullet suggests a start up error. It fires up, can't get the answer it wants but once running (and well done Enfield for not blocking the starter motor when the computer sez no, it's for your own protection SSSssssir, you know you like SSSssir, don't you...) does get it right. Usually either the battery or a connection that "dries out" under load. If it goes it'll be easier to find, if it doesn't you don't have to. Components either work or they don't. I still suspect Enfield changed my TPS when the real fix was disturbing the loom, but their money and they fixed it.

Andy

[Propellor]

Just thinking out loud.

Why not have the mil hidden in the toolbox?

Also, instead of having to ground a wire manually to get blink codes why not have a switch?