mid week topic - cheap helmets

[guest7]

At last weekend's Stafford show I saw an awful lot of interesting novelty crash helmets, ranging from funky German helmets to mad deerstalkers, all new and cheap. Now the temptation to have some fun and wear such a helmet is enormous on, say, a sunny trip to the local bike meet and I could see myself investing in such a lid for arsing around in.

However, they cannot be within a mile of current regs and may even be more dangerous in an accident. Pondering this I wondered if wearing such a novelty chromed German helmet lid is any worse than when I wear my very expensive Davida 'piss-pot' lid. Neither is legal, but I still wear the Davida.



Does anyone else sometimes deviate from the 'safety-is-everything' path when it comes to wearing a lid? It could be argued that if we were entirely sensible then we would all wear full-face lids all the time, but we don't and I'm interested in why we are prepared to let our caution slip to wear a better-looking lid. And does it matter?

GC

[el vencejo]

In the UK I mostly wore a full facer. Since I've lived in Spain I wear open-face only; in summer I use a ventilated scooter lid that cost all of 20€ and a pair of shades, its just too hot for anything else (the locals don't bother with helmets) and now that autumn has arrived I use a proper motorcycle helmet with a drop-down visor. The HG Tuareg jacket comes out now to cover the summer T-shirt along with canvas boots rather than canvas shoes;)  (I don't eat dead animals, why should I wear bits of 'em?)
I looked at a whole range of retro and novelty hemets, with all of them the polystyrene liner could be slipped out so easily, and all of them had an "E" mark, approved for what They're very popular with the scooter kids.... they usually wear them hung from their arm or handlebars, rarely on the head!

[Mark]

It could be argued that if we were entirely sensible then we would all wear full-face lids all the time, but we don't and I'm interested in why we are prepared to let our caution slip to wear a better-looking lid. And does it matter?

A full face helmet- a sure way of breaking your neck in an accident, you may survive and look pretty but paralysed.

A piss pot- a sure way of messing your face up but it absorbs impact so less likely to break your neck, you may survive and be ugly but NOT paralysed.

How do I know?....


Mark

[Dogbad]

I wore a full face lid when I had my Big Accident.  Brain injuries etc.  Open faced might have actually caused worse injury as a Fuill Face slides along the road where an Open would spin and twist giving possible rotational injuries?
Always wore Open face on the older stuff and on Chops. Now I sometimes wear full and sometimes Open. If it's time for the Shit to hit the Fan it'll happen.

[Andy M]

IMHO don't limit to thinking only about protection. Think like a battleship designer, ten feet of armour is no use if the weight of a radar, a kitchen to feed the crew etc. will sink the thing. I want comfort, a visor that doesn't mist, the ability to see more than if I climbed inside a pillar box, the ability to talk to people as well as a bit of protection if the worst does happen. That to me means the open face a lot of the time, the flip front at others.

Mind you, I doubt a plastic coal scuttle bosch helmet does any of the above.

Andy

[squirrelciv]

We've done this one to death haven't we?? The true answer here lies in the statement "Perseption is reality".

 For every story telling of the life saving properties of full face lids there will be another, equally compelling story for the virtues of open face helmets. Truth is, until the elements of your particular crash reveal themselves, no one knows which will prove safer. Statistical information is no help whatsoever, it's all just 'odds' and historical information bears no relevance to any given actual event. No, the only thing that counts is the individual riders 'perseption' of what is safe. If you 'feel' safe wearing your choice of head gear you will be free from worry, confident and relaxed for virtually all your motorcycling life. When your theory is put to the test by the particular crash you end up involved in, your view will either be vindicated [good result] or you're bu99ered [bad result]. Either way there was no way anyone could predict the outcome so chill out and be happy with your choice (or give up riding and live in a padded room).

Here endeth the lesson.

[guest868]

I think we (as consumers) probably have done this to death, still a bit of lively discussion never hurt anyone.
Having used and crashed in a variety of helmets I can say this, you get what you pay for.

The best full face helmet I have used, based on Andy's spec above, is my Arai Chaser.

The best helmet I have worn for protection was the Simpson RX8. A helmet so well put together that when I went flying into the Rover 416 roofline with my head, the helmet had no more than a bit of scuffing, whilst the Rover was written off due to the roof being creased. However the RX8 has a tiny visor aperture and fogs up. Great for summer sun, rubbish any other time. NOT to be confused with the Craft and Bandit copies. I've had a Craft and it was terrible; wafer thin visor, poor lining and thin feeling shell.
I had the misfortune to crash in a Davida Jet open face, and I can say again, that they are great well made helmets. I've tried some of the cheaper legal and illegal open face lids and again, the quality isn't there. But that's why they are £30 not £230.

One of the worst helmets I had was a Caberg J1, it was around the early 00s when flip front's were coming out more. It was flimsy, heavy, fogged up and the visor got scratched incredibly easily. My poor opinion of Caberg's still exists due to two friends having issues with them. One had the pivot screw fall out and the mechanism break, the other had the visor flip open and crack.
I won't have, nor recommend a Caberg again.

So really it comes down to personal choice, you can't predict what will happen to you, you have to go with the choices you make and hopefully not have to deal with them in the worst way possible.
If the laws were different I wouldn't wear a helmet at all for most of the lanes I potch about on, I would on the commute, and I would on longer trips. Again, personal choice but one that's been taken away from us.

[Dogbad]

I have to admit that I just use a "Cheapo pice of crap" flip fronter with the front up most of the time. I get claustrophobia with the front down , I always remember helmets giving me more Face Space in the past?

With regard to a Decent Quality Open face jobbie, what should I look to pay and any recommendations for a particular brand or model?

[Ian]

I think that if you are going to have a bad smash of any sort that involves the upper parts of your body..I dont think any helmet will protect you enough. As the saying goes...

"If its gonna happen....its gonna happen"

(All rights reserved)


Ian

[guest7]

I wondered if this would gravitate to a full-face vs open-face discussion and that's not really what I was asking. I was thinking about why we all know that a good helmet and tough jeans and jacket offer the best protection, but on the other hand we all go out (sometimes) wearing gear that we know falls short in the safety department. Does it matter?

As for good quality flip-up open-face helmets, I can recommend the Arai SZB (or whatever the model number is now)


I'm on my second Arai and it's just excellent. The fit is great, the quality excellent and the visibility nigh-on completely unobstructed.

GC

[squirrelciv]

Love my Arai open face too. 

You're right, sometimes we do ride with less than perfect protection, but hopefully we modify our style of riding to compensate in some small way.

[Steve Lake]

I'm with you #1....i too have a Davida piss pot, (mainly 'cos i used to use a real one in the early 60's......everoak i think....had 3 prangs whilst i owned it, and yes...i did modify my face in the second one)

I love the Davida....and the aero goggles that go with it...and yes I use it when i feel a bit like a 'pose'....been to the 'ace' with it on, and goodwood revival last year....
f*ck it! I say...I feel i'm at a point where I can grow old disgracefully.....which includes things like farting just when and where i feel like it.....wearing what i like on the bike (within reason)....leering unashamedly at scrumptious young women.....and lots of other things that i can't quite remember right this minute....

[guest987]

Just bought a Davida 92 to replace my Arai Freeway.

Really pleased. Won't suit everyone but proper size lid with no lift at speed. I wear open faced lid all year round now and have done for about nine years.
On sunny days will press my 1960's Everoak pudding basin into action. no protection at all but looks great.

Rob

[002]

Used to wear full face when I was Despatching.
Been wearing an open face for over 20 years now.
And the last 12 or so several Davida Classic Jets.Replaced every 2 years or so.Due to quite a lot of use.Not doing the miles now so they might last a little longer.
Cant fault them,comfortable,quite quiet,and do the job just nicely Thank You !
Crash tested one last year......destroyed my new lid !
So went out and bought another 


Jethro

[guest18]

Used to wear full face when I was Despatching.
Been wearing an open face for over 20 years now.
And the last 12 or so several Davida Classic Jets.Replaced every 2 years or so.Due to quite a lot of use.Not doing the miles now so they might last a little longer.
Cant fault them,comfortable,quite quiet,and do the job just nicely Thank You !
Crash tested one last year......destroyed my new lid !
So went out and bought another 


Jethro

Can't argue with the logic, but at £2,000.00 odds in crash helmets over 12 years one is forced to wonder if they really need replacing every couple of years or if it's just good marketing...?

As a comparison, cycle helmets are marketed quite heavily, since the "boris bikes" have been available to rent over a million hires(read trips, WITHOUT helmets being made available) have been made, in central London (scary place to ride on two wheels imho). Over that period there are only two recorded incidents of people being admitted to hospital with head injuries needing a precautionary scan... both came up clear
Yet still about once a week on a pushbike I get asked "where's your helmet?" (answer, "In the house, I'm not off road or racing!"). The power of advertising...

So do helmets need replaced every two years as per the manf? Or is it a bit of fly marketing and actually they're probably good for three, four or more? (Esp thinking decent fibre helmets here not plastic)