Author Topic: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!  (Read 1634 times)

guest18

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It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« on: December 17, 2007, 06:02:11 PM »
Ok, apologies to those who know all this already(!), however while I was “enjoying” my ride into work this morning in a still air temperature of -5deg F my thoughts fell to wind-chill and how cold it can feel on a bike.
So here’s a little table to show you just how cold it feels when you are over 60mph and it’s -5 on the thermometer…-40 deg!!  :o



“So what”? I hear you say.

Well the problems with this are two-fold. Firstly it becomes difficult to maintain your core temperature, now this is fairly obvious, and on a commute of half an hour or so unlikely to be a major factor if you have halfway decent gear and you start warm. Of course if you start cold, have inadequate gear, spend a long time on the road…. Then it can be an issue! Shivering is good, it’s the body trying to warm you up. If you stop shivering without being warmed by some outside influence then you are in the initial stages of hypothermia (really!). Your reaction time is slowing down, your thinking is becoming woolly and you will shortly want to go to sleep, you may well be experiencing mood swings and sudden bursts of enthusiasm/lethargy. These are all bad signs and none of them are making you a safer rider.
Stop and find some way of warming up!!

The second problem is far more likely however. You’ll notice on the chart that there are shaded areas marked frostbite times, 30, 10 and 5 minutes. You will also notice that on a bike in winter we can quickly get into the ten minute zone!
This chart shows the likely time by which you will start to suffer frostbite when skin is exposed to that temperature and windspeed. “No problem” you say, “I have a nice warm jacket/trousers/boots”, except that wind is curling round the visor you opened a little to prevent misting, it’s ripping round the chinpiece and numbing your chin/lips/cheeks…
Now remember, I’m not talking about going numb, or frostnip which will clear once you warm up. I’m talking about frostbite where the skin/tissue actually freezes, this causes permanent cell damage and will not get better!
This can happen inside just TEN minutes in the weather we had this morning.
If your skin is blotchy/marbled then that’s a bad sign, waxy and white is also very bad, ultimately in extreme cases it will shrivel and go black and, call me vain… but, that’s not an attractive look!!

Personally I suffer a little from vibration induced white finger, (google it for more info, or ask Bill  ;) ), which means I mostly don’t notice the numb bit but instead seem to go straight to the feeling you got as a kid when you’d been out in the snow and then came in and ran your hands under a warm tap…ouch(!) When I then warm up my fingertips go a pronounced red / pink colour and are “tingly” and oversensitive for a few hours, another indicator that I’ve done permanent damage  :(

So… what should you do?

First, well we’ve managed this bit, be aware. Remember it’s not just Antarctic explorers, it can happen to YOU here in the UK.
Second, maintain your core temperature, have a warm drink (ideally not caffeine which goes right through you! Something like hot chocolate is good), wear lots of thin layers not one thick one (yes you have an excuse to wear the missus/gf’s tights!) avoid tight clothing and consider wearing some sort of windstopper/scarf which will protect your neck/chin.
Most importantly, if you feel your face becoming sore or numb, even if you are just feeling a sharp cold draught on one part then move your facial muscles, pull faces, frown, grin, grimace, whatever… just keep them moving. It will keep the blood flowing and help slow down or prevent frostnip and frostbite, and no-one is looking inside your visor anyway so it’s nothing to be shy about  ;D

Stay safe out there…
Smudge  :)

ps, sorry for another boring post. Back to stupidity soon  ;D

themoudie

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2007, 12:09:39 AM »
And what are you expected to do as you lower yourself into that ice covered pond with a bootle on your back?  ;D

PPPPPPPpick up a penguin and put him in your suit!  ::)

Go canny Smudge.

My regards, Bill.

Andy M

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2007, 08:02:39 AM »
The 10 minute zone is easy to achieve in the UK. Get at altitude in particularly cold weather (Elefant/Dragon type stuff) and the 5 minute zone is quite possible  :o

A couple of things I'd add to Smudges excelent post; water makes things worse as it takes heat with it as if blows away. This means soaked or sweat soaked Goretex ceases to work while a one peice unlined (cheap) oversuit keeps going. The other thing is that heated clothing really works. For the body core a jacket works well (longer runs). For shorter runs socks/grips/gloves are going to make life more comfortable and avoid the nip on fingers and toes. This is course brings us back to the idea of heated underwear as if there is one thing I don't want to turn black and drop off........ ;D

Andy

Steffan

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2007, 08:41:31 AM »
One way of reducing the effect is very simple - reduce the windchill by reducing the wind ie ride slower

S

Andy M

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2007, 09:23:52 AM »
One way of reducing the effect is very simple - reduce the windchill by reducing the wind ie ride slower

S

You also have to factor in any head wind.

Just noticed this is in Farenheit! I'm surprised they don't use Furlongs per fortnight for the speed while they are at it. Doh!

Andy

Steffan

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2007, 01:17:10 PM »
well then, there is nothing to worry about. Anyone got an up to date one in metric?

S

guest18

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2007, 01:36:31 PM »
 ::) sigh... ok I'll track one down in European numbers for the colonials/foreigners  ;)

Steffan, if you took a "proper" thumper out in the winter headwind would be an issue, on the MZ 2timer however... you only need to worry about the actual windspeed as you sit at the side of the road repairing it  :P (kidding! before anyone gets too upset!)

Oh and Bill, in the ice covered pool the wind chill is nill  ;) besides, 5mm of neoprene over the handies makes for much toastiness  ;D

S

(anyone I forgot to insult?  :o   ;) )

guest18

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2007, 02:20:41 PM »


hmmm that didn't work...
try looking here:
http://www.r-p-r.com/wind_chill_table.htm

guest18

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2007, 02:35:05 PM »
Joking aside, should I be writing a similar post with suggestions for cold/wet weather riding kit? Or do we hardy lunatics know it already...? I know most of you are well sorted but sometimes it is informative to exchange ideas.. ???

Andy M

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2007, 03:28:06 PM »
Joking aside, should I be writing a similar post with suggestions for cold/wet weather riding kit? Or do we hardy lunatics know it already...? I know most of you are well sorted but sometimes it is informative to exchange ideas.. ???

Haven't got proper wet in years. I think a lot of people here ride all year round and probably know a lot. Come April-May when the leather one piece/jeans and tassles brigades come out again though you have to wonder if some people have access to some pin point weather forecast us mortals can't see.

I never had an MZ leave me stranded BTW. Unlike "proper" thumpers all you have to do when they sieze is wait for them to cool down/tip cola in the plug hole. The half bottle of cola you don't pour in the engine tastes better if it's cold   ;D

Andy

guest18

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2007, 06:38:14 PM »
Joking aside, should I be writing a similar post with suggestions for cold/wet weather riding kit? Or do we hardy lunatics know it already...? I know most of you are well sorted but sometimes it is informative to exchange ideas.. ???

Haven't got proper wet in years. I think a lot of people here ride all year round and probably know a lot.
 .....all you have to do when they sieze is wait for them to cool down/tip cola in the plug hole. The half bottle of cola you don't pour in the engine tastes better if it's cold   ;D

Andy

Cool, saves me thinking too hard then :)
Sieze? That's my point... ;D never liked riding covering the clutch ready for the random moment when the engine stops anyway... :o always struck me that an engine siezing is trying to tell you something  ;)

Keep on rangadangdanging though, it always annoys those who value style over all else.. 8)

guest7

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2007, 08:36:15 PM »
My limited experience of really cold riding has taught me a couple of things.

1. An oversuit is essential, once cordura is wet the moisture wicks into the suit lining and your fancy Goretex becomes a freezing cold waste of time.

2. Protect yourself from the wind. On my last Elefant trip Tim and I went past Regensburg an hour or so before Jethro and his group of riders. Tim and I both had extensive windshielding fitted that protected our torsos, hands, legs and feet. We thought it the coldest section of the entire ride, but not unduly uncomfortable. The second group, travelling at a higher average speed and with less shielding, found it to be so cold that they had to stop for a break. That might sound trite, but when I say 'cold' I mean they were in danger of hyperthermia.

3. Heated grips - they are so cheap now there's no reason not to have them. Again, if you fit them then consider fitting handguards as there's little point having warm palms if your fingers are in a 70mph airstream.

4. Wear a balaclava - they might look silly, but they do the job. Dainese's one is a joyful thing that keeps its shape and is warm to boot.

5. Buy your winter clothing baggy - Looser clothing keeps you warmer. This is especially true of gloves and boots. I think it must be a combination of allowing proper blood circulation and trappping air between the layers. My adage (constructed on the hoof 10 seconds ago) is, "If it's tight, it's shite"  :)

Cheers
GC

002

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2007, 10:51:37 PM »
Grow a Beard !!!!

A Proper one !  Not a George Michael affair or some other fashionable insult to facial hair. !


Jethro
Cooey
Martini-Greener GP
Lee Enfield
ELG

guest7

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2007, 11:01:43 PM »
He keeps going on about his George Michael affair...

Jethro, let it go, you deserve better than him  ;)

GC

002

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Re: It’s not just the cars that can get you….!
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2007, 11:12:16 PM »
Its just a Careless Wispa !      ::)


Jethro
Cooey
Martini-Greener GP
Lee Enfield
ELG