BlueLady has got me thinking...............

[guest27]

Billy Bragg was on the radio this am supporting free peer-peer downloading of music, saying that it is a business model that has developed because it is what the punters want, it is now for the music industry to address that model and seek to develop it so it creates income whilst not destroying the essence.

What we have here is a developing club, growing its own model.  There may be need to create income even if only to pay for the web space, or to cover some possibly insurance, print newsletter etc.  Typically this would come from membership fees.  Maybe there is a need to allow the group to develop and answer the questions, do we want this web space, are we willing to cover the costs of this web space?  Are we willing to contribute to the time taken to make this web space..  Do we want an annual rally?  Are we willing to cover the cost of setting this up, and how.  Etc etc.  I think the nature of a 'club' used to be a bunch of mates meeting in the pub / coffee bar.  They needed some badges so collected some money and so developed the XYZ motorcycle club.  Has the model changed?

Some people have written that they are takers not givers, rubbish, when I write something here I do so in the hope that someone may read it and maybe even comment - enter a dialogue.  People who just read are those people - a part of the community I need to be able to contribute.

Ditto those who have said they only ask questions - reading the questions and the answers informs us all, with out the question there would be no developing knowledge or understanding, not asking the question is taking from the group, asking the question is giving to the group.

Physical meets - I have yet to get to a rally, shed meet, Satfford etc.  Many reasons, that does not mean I do not think they are a good thing and I have been there in spirit if not in person.  However if their moment has passed so be it.  Maybe with the missapplication of health and safety we are being forced into at present we are in a time to head to the informal rather than the formal, and then their time will come again.

Bridges are for crossing, and that crossing can be a little scary, but usually when we get to the other side we can look back and see the past from a different view point, often it is a fine place, but where we are is better.

We are where we are, looking to where we are going, even if it is like a Sunday meander rather than a planned journey is a fine thing.  Worrying that it is different from the past and thus somehow "wrong" is not so useful.

Bluelady asked some interesting questions, but I think she was a taker not a giver and we are share-ers.  Neither right nor wrong, just the 'is' as it is.


R

[Steve H]

Bluelady asked some interesting questions, but I think she was a taker not a giver and we are share-ers.

Rog, I dont think you can make that assumption, I beleive she is involved in a few clubs.

[guest288]

We all sound like a wise bunch of people; the club is in all of our hands, however we look to a selected few to steer it any given direction- if members are unhappy about something, then I'm sure we can accomodate their view. I feel this is a great club, although I'm still looking to getting out to some events, and will continue to pay my fee and support it however I can. I think this forum alone and the enjoyment you lot give is worth it... 

[Andy M]

Rog makes some very good points. The traditional model does nothing for me. The BM club was a mess. No one seemed to ride, they all turned up at meetings in cars. Half engaged in club politics, half played dominoes. This wasn't a bike club it was a more like an OAP's social club. The alternative would be for the Twin's under sub-section Gruppenfuhrer to send everyone out of the room who turned up on a K or F (and blackball the car drivers), then split the oilhead riders from the airhead, like the Brit-cafe racer boys described above. I wouldn't like that either. I wasn't going to pay £2 a copy no matter how glossy their magazine was. Their "product" wasn't what I wanted so I don't buy it anymore.

The Triumph RAT thing worked better until you noticed the only time the group leader spoke to riders of older machines was to try and sell them a new one. Paid for by Triumph it was a very subtle marketing tool designed to make people ride what they bought, wearing bits out and "proving" everyone needed a Tiger/Trophy/Rocket, not a Bonneville Black. It was probably too subtle as they wound it up in that form. Guess they found it pointless talking to the likes of me about £14000, 2.3 litre bikes and probably found my laughing put the real customers off.

As Pat said, the club-that's-not-a-club thing works well for me. If the £6 a year funds it that's great. If it doesn't, perhaps we need to cut costs (move to Yahoo Groups?) or raise the membership fee. I would however suggest a £32 a year with £10 off the annual dinner isn't going to work for many on here and cheap/cheerful is probably where our market is? Isn't our market the time-poor section of the bike world who'll pop on here for a quick chat between e-mails at work rather than dominoes playing retired bank managers who want to talk about the bike they hired in Florida or get a buzz from getting elected as deputy sub-section pencil sharpener? I don't think the Run-what-you-brung thing will win us any corporate sponsers (or does anyone know a contact at WD-40 or a scrap merchants  ).

I agree with Dave. I don't think it's that broke, so in true TC style, why fix it?

Andy

[Steve H]

If the £6 a year funds it that's great. If it doesn't, perhaps we need to cut costs (move to Yahoo Groups?) or raise the membership fee.

Funding the site is not a problem, and the club has plenty of money.

[Bill Rutter]

SteveH, I've not heard anything from the VMCC about the 2009 Speed Trial dates but the Burgess Hill MCC is having a camping weekend over at the Bat & Ball this weekend so I shall bend their ears about organising something next summer.

[Steve H]

Burgess Hill MCC

Another faimiliar name, spent a lot of time in Burgess Hill in my youth.

[guest27]

Bluelady asked some interesting questions, but I think she was a taker not a giver and we are share-ers.

Rog, I dont think you can make that assumption, I beleive she is involved in a few clubs.

OK Maybe a bit strong.  And not meant as a personal attack, just remembering that she contributed quite a lot, then questioned why things were not happening, then cleared off elsewhere where she was "wanted".  The issues about membership were quite clear at the time and told many times over, but there was an assumption made that 'we' did not want 'her'.  Despite the assertions to the contrary, the fact that we were and possibly are a disheveled lot with no one currently willing to take up the membership sec role, and GC rightfully doing the stuff needed by his real family rather than us load of kids.

There did not seem to be a lot of giving, either in letting things roll - or offering to pick up the baton.  That is where I - I guess because it fits with what I do  - made a distinction.  A few of us have questioned what was happening about membership, but when not a lot happened, we were willing to let it roll and see what happens.  Possibly a few of us enquired about what was entailed with running the membership.  But not a lot of us came out and said if you do not want me I am going.

I am involved in a lot of different things, in some I am willing to let it roll, in others I take an active part in steering it, making it work.  I guess in the past I have suggested that it is someone elses job to sort out the problems I perceive.  I only do this now to the local council and MPs as they have set themselves up and deserve the pooh as well as the nice stuff.

R

[guest7]

Hello again fellas, sorry for the long absence, I've been working my nads off trying to raise enough cash to pay my tax arrears (a visit from the Distraint officer asking to value your goods focuses your mind on these things).

I haven't even sat at this chair in my office for at least a week and I've been off-line for longer.

Let me address some points.

1. Competition - turned into a mess when we asked for votes. It took absolutely ages and ages for enough votes to come in before we could say that a decision had been reached. I lost control of that one, which is a shame because it started off well.

2. Insurance - yes the club is insured. Now that we have a treasurer (Liz) in place and able to access all our accounts the money side of it has settled down. She made sure Boyd got his rally money and paid for our insurance.

3. Membership - let's face it, I was shite at this even when I ran the club out of my own pocket and I haven't got any better at it. At present it's a mess of spreadsheets and unposted memebrship packs. It will have to be sorted out soon. We had a volunteer to do this, but once it became clear that he wouldn't have internet access I had to go to Plan B. The worst thing I did was not taking up Richard Moore's offer to take this on. It's a job for someone with a methodical mind and, er, that's never going to be me.

4. The decline in interest - I started the club in the summer of 1999. I ran it on my own money for a while, then Steve and Colin came on board and we ran it more or less at cost for a while. Then Steve took over the money and the club turned a profit (essential for events and merchandise, etc.) and he reined in any silliness with money. With Steve's departure from the role of treasurer and Pat's relinquishing of the membership, 2008 was never going to be a magic year.

I have two young boys now and they take a lot of my time. This isn't a matter of choice, my wife has to work some evenings and I look after two little tearaways (after a full day at work). I don't have sick pay or paid holidays or any of those luxuries so I have to go out and earn money most days of the year. At the moment I don't have the same level of committment that I once had to the club, but I don't see it as being over. I see it as me sorting out other things in my life and letting the club take second place for a while, not for ever..

On top of everything else I have also had a few personal issues hanging around, in late December  some stuff went on that made me a little less inclined to pay attention to motorcycling matters and motorcycling people. This isn't a big issue by any means, but it hasn't helped. And just to clarify, this isn't a reference to my home life, which is miraculously intact despite the financial hardship that I have put my family under.

In some respects the club has gone full circle, most club tasks are being done by me and I'm still proving myself to be inept at administration and/or delegation.

When I think about where the club was in July 07 I could cry. We had lots of little meet-ups happening amongst members, not having to be arranged centrally. We had good admin in place and things we being done at the right time. We had a fantastic annual rally in Dent, superbly organised by Steve Dalby (although by all accounts Boyd did a great job this year too). The forum was thriving and we were adding lots of members to the club. It's not like that now though eh? 

I was hoping that I could ramp down the amount of time I spent on club stuff after nearly ten years, but no, it's back to where it started, with the exception of this fantastic website (Thank you Steve). My thoughts were that over the years the club would grow and other people would step in to shoulder the workload. We almost did get to that point, but (so I have been told) it's my failings that led to people walking away from their roles in the club. So you see it really is all my fault, my wife has been right all this time.

But by God I'm glad I started this club. I've met some fantasic people, had adventures galore and been to some great places. It's just a shame that I'm so hopeless at running the bloody thing.

GC

[squirrelciv]

GC, just read your comments and can't help but wonder if you don't feel that maybe it's time to step down as chairman and move aside to let someone else take the strain??
Personally I couldn't give a monkey's, don't want to be Chairman, don't even want to be on the committee. My point is made as a direct response to your own comments. You say you have so much personal stuff going on that keeps you away, your business adds even greater pressure and reduces your time even further, and you intimate that you've lost some of the interest in biking that is needed to drive any motorcycle club forward. You go on to admit to being, well, err, um, shall we say less than compitant at the admin side of things.
No one may want to do the job, but if they do surely it's best for the club and from what you say, best for you??

Anywho, I'm sure as departing Chairman, your last act could be to award yourself a life time membership

Just a thought. Anyone els got a comment??

[Steve H]

Graham, I hate to say this but I think Pat has a point, no one can doubt your dedication to this club, but it does need someone who has more spare time on their hands to take the reins and guide the club. Hopefully that would allow you to concentrate on the bits you are good at and allow someone else to do the co-ordinating. This thread has shown there are people who are willing to help, that offer should be taken before the club hits rock bottom.
I know how much this club means to you, and as such this issue is quite hard to address, I would just say that non-one is knocking you personally, and the fact that this thread did not dissolve into a slagging match indicates the quality of people we have here, and the respect we have for each other.

[Steve Lake]

OK....lets cut the crap.....Graham ... My personal feeling is, that the one thing you are good at (clubwise....i'm sure you are effin brilliant at loads of other things too ) is being chairman.....so stick to that, and offload all the other stuff....I know this is a bit simplistic, but just bung up a list of the jobs that you do other than chairman, and then we can all pick up a job apiece....job done.

To start the ball rolling.....If there arn't any other takers put me down for membership secretary.

I think we have probably done just about enough talking round this thing now.....lets get on with it.

[guest27]

Hear hear SteveL

GC - I may take the piss out of you - but I expect the same in return - but to suggest that the club is 'failing' because of you is utter crap. Because you have done a good job we have sat back and let it happen.

Not sure what I can do - but if you get a chance of a list of jobs needing doing other than being "Chairman" I will see if there is anything a bod less organised than you can pick up.

R

[Bill Rutter]

I popped over to the bike meet at the Bat & Ball to meet up with Stuart who organises the Diesel Bike Rally. He looked a bit shocked when I mentioned our H&S waiver (sorry if that's not the right word) so he is looking into getting that side of things sorted. John, the owner of the pub was a bit disorganised as to booking things for next year but said there's plenty of time to organise things for a September get-together. So nearer the time (and when I get a definate date for the Speed trials in Brighton) I will set the ball rolling.

[guest146]

Hi

Tell me more about the diesel bike Rally please.

One day when I have free time I would like to make one up.

Ken