Thumper Club Forum
Club House => Chatter => Topic started by: chippit on April 06, 2011, 07:32:14 PM
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I need to buy some camping gear and throw over type panniers, can anyone recommend anything they have found to be good. I don't want to spend a fortune on a tent, it's first outing will be the bulldog bash.
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have a look at www.cpc.co.uk , type in tent in the search panel at the top of the page, should put up some good quality REASONABLY PRICED coleman tents, AND LOTS OF OTHER CAMPING GOODIES ON THERE AS WELL.
I'D ALWAYS TRY FOR A TENT WITH FLYSHEET AND INTEGRAL GROUNDSHEET. I INVESTED IN A LIGHTWEIGHT INFLATEABLE GROUNDSHEET, GIVES GOOD INSULATION FROM THE GROUND AND A DEGREE OF COMFORT.
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ive just bought another quechua 2 second tent. its the same as the old one we have been using for 8 years without it leaking a drop of water in, except that these new ones pack down to kalf the size of the old ones and so are easy to carry on a bike!
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Gelert Nikina Plus. £30ish, single pole 2 man (so ample room for 1 plus gear) packs down small - easily fits in throwover pannier. Waterproof enough for (most) British weather, mine has not yet leaked and I seem to remember Simon Morgan used one at an extreme rally in Germany the other winter.
(http://www.comparestoreprices.co.uk/images/ge/gelert-nakina-plus.jpg)
Down sleeping bag (3 season + cotton liner) Blacks own brand packs really small. About £60 as I remember
Cheapish 6 tube blow up airbed. about £10
This will all fit in one pannier leaving the other for stove, kettle, etc.
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I would agree with most of the choices above except for the 6 tube airbed, you will be sliding off it in all directions !
A roll mat would be sufficient but if you must then a self inflating camp mat can be had fairly cheap these days.
The sleeping bag can be upgraded for future (colder) use with an inner bag and a bivvy bag. Have a look at the snugpak range.
There is an impressive amount of gear for sale these days, just depends how deep your wallet is, and mine is notoriously shallow.
Now we can start a row about which stove is best ! I say a Swedish Army surplus Trangia.
Richard.
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Now we can start a row about which stove is best ! I say a Swedish Army surplus Trangia.
Richard.
Bollocks ! No it aint ! ;D
Jethro
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I would agree with most of the choices above except for the 6 tube airbed, you will be sliding off it in all directions !
Yes admittedly that can be a pain, but it does pack up very small! - I've started putting the airbed in a cheap old sleeping bag liner which stops the problem.
At the risk of restarting stove wars, I use a Camping gas Tristar modified to fit inside my saucepan which fits inside the blue bag - my rally cooking is minimal, cups of tea /coffee and the odd can of something, any more than that and I go to the nearest cafe or pub!
(http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRU7zzjUyJe079_yf8cQZRx04e1GfdgGzy5CDz04W76cmjfYqqd&t=1)
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Now we can start a row about which stove is best ! I say a Swedish Army surplus Trangia.
Richard.
I have just bought one of those.It's not been used properly yet,only a test run to boil some water,time will tell. ;D
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Green snugpak sleeping bags are cheaper like for like than their more, erm... "civilian" colours! and they have a larger range.
Tent, nice to have a good one but practically if you're just trying out get one cheap enough to treat as disposable (unless a bargain comes up). swmbo went on freecycle recently and picked up a good 6 person tent for her guides that had only been used once(!) so worth a look there for a freebie maybe?
Personally I don't like airbeds, a nice idea but they just seem to leave you perched on a bed of cold air, better with a rollmat or if the budget will allow either a thermarest copy or ideally the real thing (they take a hammering and last, and they are comfy and warm!).
As someone else pointed out, a (proper breathable) bivi bag is a good thing. The ex army ones are good and one of the few ex forces issue things I have actually gone out and spent my own money on :o
Stoves...well there's a can of worms on this forum! Most readily available camping stoves will work, most people have their own preferences! Gas is convenient, clean and available but not great if you plan doing extreme cold weather events. Primus/multifuel/white gas etc pressure stoves can be smelly/noisy and are loved by some and hated by others. they are very fast and work in all weathers though. Spirit stoves *may* be slow but are reliable and cheap(ish) often. You pays your money and takes your choice. In an ideal world borrow one until you work out what you want. :-)
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bivvi bags, the breathable ones that is, dont work inside a tent. you might as well sleep in a bin liner. bivvy bags are designed to be used outdoors, theyre only breathable if you are in moving air, this is what makes the moisture wick away through the material and keeps you (relatively) dry and comfy. if you use a bivvy bag in a tent or out of the breeze, the moisture just stays put inside the bag and you end up feeling damp!
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I would tend to avoid Butane canisters though, worst of both worlds. Butane/Propane mix is okay.
I do sometimes sleep in the bivvy, leaving the tent at home. Bit of a bugger when it rains in the morning though.
I do believe that Steffan may have the best tent option for a solo that I have seen, just about able to stand up to get changed into your waterproof bike kit. Expensive though, my Polish Army surplus is a cheap attempt to get the same advantage but doesn't really cut it - bulky and heavy.
Richard
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@Johnr, I'd have to disagree on that, I've used an ex army one (bivi bag) even indoors in a cold building and not felt damp.
ymmv though!
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but goretex as with all breathable materials will only 'breathe' if there is airflow over it. thats how it works, the airflow removes the water vapour but the materials construction stops the water particles from getting in from the outside. if there is no airflow over the outside of the bag, then the material cant 'breathe' and the moisture in the air inside wont get out. if you were inside a building, i guess you werent buried inside the bag breathing out your moisture laden breath into the bag like you might do on a cold open hillside?
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Can't say I'm knowledgable about the process, all I can say with conviction is I've never been damp/wet in one of the ugly brown/green ex army "mvp" bags. I've been using them in buildings/bashas/tents for the best part of fifteen years now and being a little bu**er I tend to slide down into the bag when it's cold(!) despite "knowing better".
I have in the past seen "official" instruction pointing out that you should never hide inside the bag with your face covered for two reasons, one is the moisture laden breath you mention making the bag damp and reducing its effectiveness (or allowing it to freeze if you are in silly temperatures!), the second is because if you fold the top over and make a half reasonable seal you can allegedly prevent fresh air getting in and suffocate yourself! (though I've never heard of it myself)
That's why "mummy" bags are designed to close up and cover everything except your face.
Regardless of all that, opinions may vary, but my suggestion is that a bivi bag can add a season to the range of a sleeping bag and the ones discussed have worked well for me and friends of mine in locations from pretty warm to blooming cold :)
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I hate that enclosed feeling when you withdraw into the nether regions of the bivvy. What many people do is use them upside down, I believe you should have the longer top on top of you, to keep the water off your face. Otherwise any rain collects on the lower and runs into the bivvy.
I always thought, but may be wrong, that in a mummy bag you kept your nose outside (to breathe in) and your mouth inside (to breath warm air into the bag). Not been 'moist' yet.
And wear a hat.
Richard
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On tents, our experience last year was that a three-person tent is needed for two people unless they are extremely friendly all the time and/or the weather is cold. We bought a Blacks Octane 3 for £229, which is the best price we could find for a fairly lightweight tent. We then did 700 miles cycle-camping down through France and into Spain, and the tent was terrific. Huge storm in the shadow of the Pyrenees didn't bother it at all.
We have a Trangia meths stove and I'm not so sure about that. Fuel easily available in Europe but it uses a lot of it. Languid flame - woks need not apply. I also have a terrific Optimus Hunter paraffin pressure stove which reminds me of the highly desirable Mamod steam engine the boy next door had, the bastard. However, the Oppy is heavy, noisy and quite thirsty. People increasingly say get a posh multifuel, it seems.
We have two jolly good 'self-inflating' (huh!) Thermarest mats and OK-ish sleeping bags by Lamina, also a cycle trailer by Carry Freedom, but it probably wouldn't survive a continuous 70 mph without its quickly detachable wheels quickly detaching. Nobody seems to make a motorcycle luggage trailer in the UK. I rather fancy one, if anyone knows of such a thing. No point in half measures - one might as well look completely ridiculous.
Martin
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Nobody seems to make a motorcycle luggage trailer in the UK. I rather fancy one, if anyone knows of such a thing. No point in half measures - one might as well look completely ridiculous.
Martin
The best trailer I've ever seen for the solo motorcyclist/camper is the Pav which used to be imported at one time by Jawa/CZ. No longer available new, and expensive when they turn up on Ebay but I'm sure it wouldn't be that hard to make something similar. They track beautifully .
(http://www.realclassic.co.uk/bikepix/jawa07080301.jpg)
(http://www.saigonscootercentre.com/imgMaxi/Pav_Replica_b.jpg)
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There's a UK firm called Mono-Trail making similar trailers. Bloody expensive though!
Here's a linky...
http://www.mono-trail.co.uk/index.html (http://www.mono-trail.co.uk/index.html)
Dave B
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The chassis and hitch are incredibly simple, body could be made from big top box type thingy. You would need to source an suitable suspension unit and small wheel but I'm sure there is something out there. Would make a nice little.
project.
http://www.pav.se/pavinfo-eng.html (http://www.pav.se/pavinfo-eng.html)
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modern scooter front wheel would do for one of them
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And make a one-wheeler from an old wheelbarrow. Mind you, I don't see what's wrong with two wheels, myself. Simplifies the tow-hitch no end if it doesn't have to hold the thing up as well. But I'd better shut up now because I've taken us miles off topic.
Martin
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hi chippit, a tent i would avoid is the kyham biker.we bought one a couple of years ago and only used it a couple of times.Its awkward to erect,the pack size is huge,and it blows flat in the wind,it also weighs a ton and it wasnt cheap. As for a stove ive been camping this weekend with the sunbeam boys and used a penny stove all weekend with total success (i hadnt heard of a penny stove until they were discussed on the forum a few months ago) and it cost nothing to make (still took my trangia just incase but didnt need it) hope this information helps
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bivvi bags, the breathable ones that is, dont work inside a tent.
Thats crap as far as im concerned,
they act as another layer in very cold climates very well,i use mine all the time when necessary and would recommend one to everybody
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Just bought a Vango Force 10 from ebay. A mk4 nylon outer. ;D ;D ;D
Always wanted one since I was a kid. Chuffed me
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Nice find Pat, I've been on the look out for one of those despite having too many tents already.
Richard
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That brings back memories, the vango force 10 was used on all the school trips.
I would much rather buy something I know will last. Not too big and heavy for the back of the bike?
Thanks for all advise, I think the penny stove is brilliant and I will look back over the forums to find the bit about stoves.
Regards Christine
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hi chippit, a tent i would avoid is the kyham biker.we bought one a couple of years ago and only used it a couple of times.Its awkward to erect,the pack size is huge,and it blows flat in the wind,it also weighs a ton and it wasnt cheap.
I agree with you on that one.I bought a Khyam Biker a copule of years ago.I couldn't believe the size and weight of the thing when I got it on the back of the bike.I set it up once in the garden then sold it to a mate.I now have a Vango Tempest 300 which I am pleased with.
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I must say I love my Khyham 3-man dome (not the biker). If I could only have one tent, that would be the one I'd keep. It's a little bigger than the one man Vango coffin thing I use for overnighters, but who wants wet weather pole threading hell when it's snowing. I've just got another Khyham you can stand upright in for family tricks.
I think if you had trouble putting it up you were probably being too subtle. Just grab it and make it go. My first one lasted ten years including two Elefant rallies and countless Dragons/winter camps.
Andy
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That brings back memories, the vango force 10 was used on all the school trips.
I would much rather buy something I know will last. Not too big and heavy for the back of the bike?
The nylon outer version packs up OK. Is 7kg dry, but I'm sure the bike can cope. ;D Pitched it in the garden last night, loads of room! Bring on the rallies!
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Ah Force 10s. I had my first menagé in one of them up near Grantown on Spey at the tender age of 17. Good tents and good times :D
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bivvi bags, the breathable ones that is, dont work inside a tent.
Thats crap as far as im concerned,
they act as another layer in very cold climates very well,i use mine all the time when necessary and would recommend one to everybody
go on then, how does a breathable bivvi bag work, we arent talking about it being another layer, im talking about using a breathable goretex type bivvi bag inside a tent. in order to remove the moisture from a bivvi bag, there needs to be air flow over it, thats not crap, thats a fact, for the moisture inside a bivvi bag to be removed the air needs to be able to flow over the outside of the bag. bivvi bags arent designed to keep you warm, theyre made to keep you dry. the reason they are waterproof is because they are made to be used outside. its pretty pointless to use one inside a tent anyhow,
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bivvi bags, the breathable ones that is, dont work inside a tent.
Thats crap as far as im concerned,
they act as another layer in very cold climates very well,i use mine all the time when necessary and would recommend one to everybody
go on then, how does a breathable bivvi bag work, we arent talking about it being another layer, im talking about using a breathable goretex type bivvi bag inside a tent. in order to remove the moisture from a bivvi bag, there needs to be air flow over it, thats not crap, thats a fact, for the moisture inside a bivvi bag to be removed the air needs to be able to flow over the outside of the bag. bivvi bags arent designed to keep you warm, theyre made to keep you dry. the reason they are waterproof is because they are made to be used outside. its pretty pointless to use one inside a tent anyhow,
:D :D :D,thanks for that
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Hmm. Interesting.
Seems to me we have 3 options.
1. someone here is telling a fib - highly unlikely as we're all mates with no hidden agendas.
2. bivvi/tent users here don't respire whilst sleeping - highly unlikely. Although they may be Gods of motorcycling, I'm pretty sure they're mortal the rest of the time.
3. there is enough air surrounding the bivvi whilst in the tent to allow it to breath - Most likely. As an experienced tent user I can vouch for plenty of air movement in there.
Interesting when theory meets fact. For my money facts rule and if the theory no longer fits then it needs challenging. After all the World was flat right up to (and slightly beyond) the point some smart ar5e sailed round it! ;D ;D ;D
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Perhaps given the sheer rate of wind breakage around here there is indeed plenty of air movement.
I actually think you have put your finger on it here, most tents I use have air movement. How much moisture,perspired rather than respired, can actually penetrate a thick sleeping bag never mind the bivvy I am unsure of. Certainly I only get moisture issues when I breathe out inside the bag (stop sniggering and thinking of socks at the back).
Richard
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(stop sniggering and thinking of socks at the back).
Richard
I was thinking of socks at the front. :D
Value for money tent for compactness for solo motorcyclist I'd go for this http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VANGO-ZETES-200-2-MAN-TENT-BLACK-EXCALIBUR-NEW-/250804346335?pt=UK_SportsLeisure_HikingCamping_Tents_JN&hash=item3a651a9ddf
But for that little extra room I'd recommend one with a porch for your gear, something along the lines of this http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Vango-Beta-250-Tent-Black-Excaliber-2-Person-Tent-/370500665327?pt=UK_SportsLeisure_HikingCamping_Tents_JN&hash=item56438f7fef