Author Topic: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.  (Read 2000 times)

guest1667

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Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« on: June 21, 2013, 08:40:15 AM »
Does anyone in the Thumper Club own an Aprilia Moto 6.5?  I recently bought a 1997 model and am experiencing some carburetor problems since buying the bike. When starting it from cold and full choke is applied, it fires almost immediately but then stops because the revs are barely above normal tickover: I also run a Ducati 600 Monster with similar carbs. and when it`s choke is applied, the revs soar instantly. When the engine finally starts on the Aprilia (after maybe a minute of trying) and warmed up, the bike runs rough at idle speeds (in any gear); acceleration and running under load (out of town speeds), it runs perfectly with expected performance. The carb. has been overhauled and cleaned by Mikuni expert; plug, H.T lead and cap renewed. Does anyone have any clues as to the problem?  Thanks   

500 T C

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2013, 06:47:22 PM »
         I would be tempted to strip the carb down ,and check out float level dimension,correct jets,etc.Check all the holes for blockages. I have used these "experts", found one pot running very rich (destroyed a brand new NGK) stripped the carb and found an o-ring at the bottom of the mixture screw.  Wish I had invested in a can of carb cleaner!
       Its always some thing simple,just be very methodical,with a manual at hand.

guest1667

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2013, 06:57:02 PM »
Thanks 500TC. I`ve  stripped it down and cleaned it myself for the umpteenth time and think I know every orifice in the carb. now! Most of the jets are new, including the float assembly, the level of which is correct.  But I`ll keep on investigating.  Thanks again.     

Ian

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2013, 08:25:19 PM »
Have you tried something as simple as fresh fuel...I know stale fuel can cause all sorts of "problems"

HTH

Ian
1 New SRX 1 C400X 1 GB350S

guest295

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2013, 08:03:49 AM »
There's also the problem of sin: cold idling damages engines. If you put it into gear and under load, it will warm faster while you ride, and the engine will last longer. Your grandmother may have told you to "warm the motor up" before setting off, but you're not driving a Model T.

tj63

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2013, 05:19:15 PM »
There is one owner (at least) on here. He logs on as Motomic I think. It may be worth dropping him a message.

Trevor

Steve H

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2013, 06:05:58 PM »
Have you checked the valve clearances ?, I would also think about doing a compression check.

guest1667

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2013, 10:00:40 PM »
Thanks everyone for your input so far, re: carb. problems with the Aprilia. I`ve done everything that`s been suggested up to now; I`ll keep on hunting for a solution.   Thanks

guest1686

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2013, 02:47:51 PM »
Hi Lefthand

I've got a 6.5 that i've had from new.

I love the bike, but it has never been a good starter.

My wife has been ill these last three years and i've not had it out of the garage.

She's died now and I'm wanting to use the bike again.

The symptoms on starting are exactly as you describe. It would reluctantly start on full choke,

but stall as soon as you open the throttle. After it warms up at idle its possible to get it to pull away,

but there is always a weak section at mid throttle where it misfires. Change down and you can get through it.

A garage I took it to suggested, old fuel, and a breakdown of paint overspray inside the tank.

They recommended taking it for a long run, I did, same symptoms when I got back.

My questions, what carb does it have, is it a Hein?, and are there any instruction manuals for stripping it

down, checking and cleaning jets and setting it up again etc.

PS Can't get it going at all at the moment.

Regards

Tony

guest1686

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2013, 09:29:27 AM »
Hi All

Can anyone steer me towards a workshop manual for the Aprilia Moto 6.5

Cheers

Tony

motomic

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2013, 08:20:33 PM »
Hi, just spotted this, sorry if this is annoying but mine performs just fine and only snatches a little if I try to go at very slow speed on a farm track.  I did used to have big problems getting the thing to start but that has gone away since a carb clean and a new rubber inlet to carb thingy.  When I took the old one off I found a split that was not obvious when in situ so guess that might have been the cause.

Sorry I cannot offer a solution other than strip and check the carb and also timing?  I can offer the prosepect that is will run properly though as mine does, rough running is not a characteristic of the model.

I have engine and cycle manuals on PDF, if anyone would like to PM me with their email address I will send them on togehter with anything else I dig out.  Might see you at the show in Oct, have to check diary though as may be away that weekend.

mic

motomic

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2013, 08:24:39 PM »
come to think of it my mate who borrowed the bike for a while last year was always complaining of it stalling but it never does that on me.  Neither of us can undersand this and my only thought is it likes to rev and I think he wanted to plonk.

Mikuni BST 40 carb by the way, I have a manual for that too if you pm me

guest1859

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2014, 06:06:51 PM »
This topic is quite old,  but I wonder if the problem was ever resolved.

I have a Moto 6.5 with exactly this problem. I know the carb is fine,  the inlet manifold is new but it still won't run for more than a few seconds. The bike stops back through the carb and stalls.

The manual suggests two possible actions. Either the ignition trigger is not adjusted properly or the decompressor is disengaging too early. This last is a balance weight on the exhaust camshaft and I don't understand how it woof
works at all.

Anybody got any suggestions about fixing my bike? Beyond finding a quarry of course.

guest1883

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2014, 10:09:04 PM »
Gentlemen,

As a US Moto 6/5 owner, I am kinda on my own.  So I have been addressing the carb problems on my Moto since I acquired it 5 years ago.  Here are some things I've learned about starting and operation of the Rotax 5 valve.  Open the fuel cock a few minutes before starting the bike.  It seems the float bowl fills slowly and trying to crank on it before the bowl is full is going to prolong the starting process.  Extending cranking on the engine is also a strain on the starter motor and spag clutch.  If the bike becomes a very unreliable starter, check the ignition pick up unit near the sprag clutch or have a pro check it.  Mine accumulated metal filings from a worn prag starter clutch that resulted in intermittent shorts, killing the signal to the CDI spark box under the seat.

Assuming your starting/running problem is in fact a carbonation problem--it starts with the enricher (choke) engaged but isn't drivable when cold--your issue is likely a lean mixture problem.  At idle to 1/4 throttle, the pilot jet mixture screw located on the bottom of the carb controls the fuel mixture on the stock Mikuni BST40 carb.  Assuming you don't have an air leak between the carb and cylinder head (spray the manifold and rubber hose area with WD 40 or some other light oil to see if it changes the engine speed to test for leaks), you may need to richen the pilot (idle) jet circuit by screwing the pilot jet needle out in 1/4 increments.

This screw is a pain to adjust particularly with the engine running because it is hard to tell how far you are turning it with a conventional screw driver.  An easier solution is to purchase a fuel mixture thumb screw from Stenhouse racing in the US.  See this link.  http://stenhouseracing.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=5_4&products_id=1  There may be other such suppliers in the UK & Europe. 

Regardless whether you use the stock screw or the Stenhouse type thumbscrew, with the engine off, turn the pilot jet screw clockwise until it bottoms out.  Be gentle, don't try to tighten the screw once it bottoms in its seat.  Keep track of how many revolutions you turned the screw and write that down as a reference point.  Now, turn the screw back out counterclockwise 2 turns.  That should get you in to the range where you can get the engine running and avoid stalling when pulling away.  Don't expect the 650 Rotax to run smooth just off idle when cold, even when perfectly tuned.  It requires some warm up.  But at 10C or 50F degrees the engine shouldn't die when pulling away from a cold start.  In fact, leave the enricher on for a 1/4 to 1/2 mile of running when the engine is cold.  This will help richen up the mixture until the engine starts to warm up.  Depending on conditions it may not fully warm up for 15 minutes or so.

You can fine tune the pilot (idle) mixture screw by getting the engine completely warmed up and experimenting with different settings to get the fastest idle and the best engine performance from idle to 1/4 throttle.  If the bike surges in town when the engine is warm, the setting is probably too lean.  Turn the screw counterclockwise in 1/4 turn increments to richen the mixture until the surging stops.  If the engine feels boggy and doesn't like taking the throttle or seems to load up on fuel and gets poor fuel economy turn the screw in in 1/4 turn increments for sharper performance. 

Be advised that the idle pilot/idle screw setting can be a bit different from 10C/50F degrees to 30C/86F degrees.  That's why the thumbscrew pilot jet screws are so handy for fine tuning. 

I hope this helps.  If you want to discuss Moto 6/5 tuning in more depth, send me an e-mail at stradakat@gmail.com.  I don't have all the answers but I've spent a good bit of time tuning on the Moto and can point you to some helpful resources. 

guest1859

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Re: Aprilia Moto 6.5 carburetor problem.
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2014, 08:08:10 PM »
Thank you for your comments, much appreciated.

I have only just solved the problem,  and it only goes to show that after 35 years of bikes you really should go back to the basics when you get a problem.

I replaced the coil, lead and plug,  the ECU, had the carb rebuilt,  prayed and threatened it and prepared to dump it in the sea.  But I couldn't let it go.

So I went through it from first principles,  and found that the problem was a dodgy sidestand switch,  that though the stand was down.  So simple,  but I hadn't checked it. First it the one-time,  permanent way. Got it all running well,  went to go for a ride,  engaged gear, stalled. Turns out the bike now thinks I am trying to ride away with the stand down,  so stalls when I engage gear. 

Next problem is that the removed switch has three wires but the wiring diagram shows only two. A bit of application and the ECU now believes the stand is up at all times so doesn't stall when I engage gear.

Bike back to health,  as good as I hoped.  The rebuilt carb makes it a sweet starteer and runner. An ace bike,  and I'm not likely to meet another!

The lesson: before looking for the tricky solutions,  check the obvious easy ones.  If I had done this I would have saved a lot of time and money.

Ian.