Author Topic: Start the week topic  (Read 1027 times)

guest7

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Start the week topic
« on: December 04, 2006, 09:46:01 PM »
As an old punk rocker I still have an idea that you have to earn the right to wear a badge or behave in a certain way. I have little time for artifice or dishonesty.

For example, I think that sportsbikers should only buy crotch rockets when they have proved that they can scratch with a degree of competence.

I also think that you shouldn't own a motorcycle unless you show some willingness to work on the bike yourself. I wouldn't say that I am an accomplished mechanic, but I have tackled most jobs on my humble XBRs. I wouldn't dream of paying someone to change a clutch cable, swap head bearings or bleed my brakes. So, this is my topic: can you be a biker if you never work on your own bike?

Cheers
GC

guest27

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2006, 09:48:26 PM »
By your definition - no.

I guess by others - yes.

What constitutes -work on - does cleaning it count?

Can you be a biker if none of your bikes work?

R

guest18

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2006, 10:39:31 PM »
can you be a biker if you never work on your own bike?

Yes, certainly... I see no dishonesty there? If however you put oil under your nails and *claim* that work done on your bike was yours then that is dishonest and beyond the pale.

I sometimes pay people to do jobs I'm capable of doing on bikes or cars because I don't have the time or tools or whatever to do them at that particular moment in time. Does that mean I'm not a biker/landy owner or whatever?

It's like saying a fisherman isn't a real fisherman if they take broken gear to a shop to have it repaired? Makes no sense to me as an argument!

002

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2006, 10:59:41 PM »
I work on other peoples !

Does that count ?

Mind most of them are incapable then make comments to the looks of my machines.

Unlike them I dont have the inclination to titivate but do have the ability to make certain everything works as it should or if not improve.

But there again I do not want to be associated with the Sub-culture of Bikers but do class myself as a Motorcycle Enthusiast.The reason being I feel I can and do appriciate all forms of Two Wheelerdom.I dont have to like the ideal but do approve the craftsmanship/idea/ability or whatever motivation went into it.

Yes I do like all forms of Bike be it a scooter,crotch rocket,cafe racer,chop etc etc...

So There !   I'm not a biker,I'm a Motorcycle Enthusiast !

Jethro
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steveD

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2006, 11:20:15 PM »
I would personally love to have a nice garage to work on my bikes, but the reality is that I have only my front garden and this weather lately is not exactly conducive to working outside. For many a year I did work on my bikes and did some quite trick engineering ie Brit bikes that didn't leak oil! But now I find myself just wanting to ride!
I have an excellent mechanic who will do any job that I want and charges less than I earn in a day, so it seems reasonable to go to my work in comfortable conditions and let him get on with the work. I go and pick the bike up ready to ride.(Don't tell him!)
He doesn't do anything that I cannot do myself or have the gear to do, but quite frankly when I have spare time I want to be off and not spending my time fixing bikes. I usually carry spare levers and cables which are nothing to replace, except for the throttle cable on the DR, that's a days work just to get the tanks off!Example, DR not working and 'needs' front wheel re-spoking in SS
(South Wales killed the charging system). I will drop it off at his place and he will repair it, I pay and ride it again, job done. I could make a jig with my welding gear and re-spoke the front wheel (served my time as a Toolmaker), I could spend hours outside in the rain tracing the 'leccy problem, but why? I'm far too old to spend time on such things when I could be riding.
I usually carry more than enough tools to do any mechanical roadside repair 'cos I'm mainly out on the road when I have spare time or yachting. I seldom spend a weekend at home.
I do consider myself a biker, but not the T**t on a sportsbike that overtook me in the rain in very blustery conditions ,when I was at least 'making good progress', on a tight bend on double lines, I shouldn't think he will last for long whetever his preferences!
If I'm not working I'll be away on my bike camping!

beeman

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2006, 11:53:05 PM »
I used to believe that to be a motorcyclist/biker/ enthusiast you had to know how it works, to some extent. Now I think that with the new breed of bikes with electronics fuel injection etc to do anything bar minor tinkering can cause more problems than it solves.
I used to do my car mechanics now I pay some one else, does this stop me being a motorist. I still do much of the bike work but farm out work to more competent mechanics as and when.
I think this has as much to do with how much money I earn and spare time I have (not much, for both).
So for some one like me who has been messing with engines for 30 years most jobs are achievable, if I wanted. Anyone starting today would be struggling to do even the simple things. after all learning on an old cheap British single etc was a dead easy. a modern multi is a whole new ball game, even taking the fairing off can lead to costly damage if done wrong..
Now I believe that a motorcyclist/biker is anyone who rides a bike, making sub divisions on how much they ride when they ride and how much they do the mechanics on the machine just divides an already struggling minority road user group, which is just what the government want.

To me if you like bikes, ride bikes, own bikes or are just interested in bikes I'm happy to accept you into the world of motorcycling.

God is this drivel I'd better stop.

beeman
We all get Heavier as we get Older because there is a lot more information in our heads

J Hop

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2006, 11:54:26 PM »
I personally dont like the term biker, to me it conjures up  a vision of a long haired tattooed type who likes "rock" music but has probably never ridden a motorbike in his life, but likes the image, and it's a stereotype IMO.(no offence to long haired tattooed types lol)

Most of the best bikers (racers) do it as a job and never ride a bike for pleasure (doohan,rossi?)etc

I like the fact that ppl buy bikes as a fashion statement and never ride them, it allows me to to buy late,low mileage bikes for small money <thumbs up>

Confession:- I've ridden more than 300,000 miles but haven't got my knee down yet. Oh well, and I do all the work on my bikes, but don't consider myself a biker but a rider.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2006, 11:58:57 PM by J Hop »

squirrelciv

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2006, 08:30:04 AM »
Hmm can see where your coming from GC, but I have to accept their are a lot of bikers out there that don't deal in the mucky side of things. For me it's all about attitude toward the bike. If you love it, care for it(even if that's getting a mechanic to fix it for you) and respect it then your biker enough for me, whatever you ride. However if you just keep it as a fashion accessory, and treat it as a toy, then you're probably not.
Live long, live well, live happy

Andy M

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2006, 08:53:16 AM »
The dishonesty thing I do find annoying at times. Worse still are people who look down on you because of the looks of what you ride. The crotch-rocket crowd I find comical. By lunchtime on Friday (if it's fine) there will be 3 1000cc plus sports bikes in the shed here. 1 is owned by a guy who races 600's in some national championship, his bike is 7-8 years old has various battle scars and is really really quick. He does the usual stuff to keep his ride going but has a mate who likes getting his hands dirty more than riding. One of the others is 3 months old and has 400 miles on the clock. This guy can't ride round corners (hence his second bike in a year), is annoyingly slow and thinks both my bikes are for learners. Anytime he breaks it it goes to the dealers. Guess who wears the full leathers and black-and-deckered knee sliders! . (I once put some old sliders on the BMW outfits cylinders and tight leathers guy thought you could actually fly the chair that high!).

I have no interest in riding in circles (except very large ones), but even in the sports bike crowd I'd rate someone who could lap at 70 on a tuned up 125 over muppets who simply buy an 1100cc plastic missile. I will however offer to race anyone. But, I pick the course and the rules. "See you in Marrakesh" usually stops the **** taking and starts the excuses!

The classic/cruiser crowd had a few odd habbits too. Their big thing seems to be assuming that my aim is to copy some old blokes bike in minute detail. The Bonneville attracts crowds who want to point out the gearbox castings are "wrong". I point out they don't leak oil. Still, even in a crowd of polishers who bring their sculptures to shows on trailers you'll find the buy who can get a 30's bike to Australia and back, so I try to ignore the jokers and get on with the riding.

I'm really glad this is a riders club!

As for the maintenance thing, I think you have to learn if you ride. Doing the Elefant at the end of January and the Dragon in February and wanting to be ready for the Easter hols is no time to find a dealership has a 4 month wait to change oil. If you've found that decent mechanic who does actually realise that people use a bike as transport, you could be fine, but self sufficiency is better. I used to let BMW sort everything, which was fine until they lost the plot and refused to book services at the one before. They simply couldn't understand that I could plan a service every 6-months but would be stuffed if they got busy and made me wait over a week. Triumph in Leeds don't even keep oil filters in stock at times!

The technology thing is going to be interesting. FI and ABS etc. are actually very simply to deal with. It either works or it doesn't. If it doesn't work you do some simple tests and either find that blown fuse, blocked pipe etc. or you don't. The next test is simplicity itself, you plug in a lap top and it tells you what to change. Going to a workshop to let them plug it in to me is only the same as not grinding your own crank, not owning a frame alignment jig etc. The mystery that some people associate with electronics is garbage that comes from untrained, ill equipped technicians trying to fix what they don't understand and stuffing it up. I work with trucks and have been offered peoples daughters (OK, well not quite) for getting Mercedes Actros/new DAF's etc. back on the road. I look good only because the four guys who tried before were trying to fix a computer with an adjustable spanner!

Still, each to their own, lets just ride.

Andy

guest27

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2006, 01:06:32 PM »
So you cannot fix a computer with an adjustable spanner - bugger how about a hammer - if the Mac is not working do I need to hit it harder?

<smiles>

R

guest7

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2006, 08:32:57 PM »
Some interesting replies here. Anyone who knows me will know that I'm not a biking fascist, far from it. What does annoy me though is people who are happy to 'wear' a biking persona without having any desire to fully engage in the lifestyle. The office types who stop shaving on Wednesday because they are on a Harley run on Saturday always make me laugh.

But what right have I got to laugh at anyone? Erm... aargh... uhhh... I don't have any right do I?

I think part of it for me is the simple fact that I eat, sleep and breathe motorcycles. I do have trouble understanding how you can buy a bike just for weekends. From my besotted viewpoint a bike rider who has never heard of Hailwood or RRT2 gearboxes is a charletan. I suppose that makes me a bit of an arse.

Andy's reply contained something that all Thumper riders have to endure, the disrespect from other riders because thumpers are slow (yeah right). That gets me wound up a treat :-)

GC

Steve Lake

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #11 on: December 05, 2006, 09:29:24 PM »
mmmm lots of good stuff there.....probably the main reason i do track days on my srx track bike is to stick one up the plastic rocket riders, who take the pi55 out of my srx road bike and my crummy (but superb) black leathers.......but i'm probably coming down to their level in doing so.
since my first bike (bsa bantam) i've always done my own work, as i progressed and gained experience (bu55ering up things on the way, but only once) i took on more of my own work. but there are always things that i can't do, and i'm more than happy to trust that work to an expert, its finding the expert that is the big trick! and i don't think that makes me any the less a 'proper' biker, nor for that matter does the fact that most of my biking is purely for pleasure.
but then I'm  just a bloke with some bikes.....AND i nod to scooter riders....(lets face it some of these scooters have a bigger engine/more bhp than my srx!) AND they'll hopefully be 'real' bikers one day.....it's all blummin daft i reckon...

guest18

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2006, 11:03:51 PM »

Andy's reply contained something that all Thumper riders have to endure, the disrespect from other riders because thumpers are slow (yeah right). That gets me wound up a treat :-)

GC

Yes, but the ones who actually believe that are the ones it's npt worth listening to ;-)
I had a police rider once congratulate me on my riding in the wet on the XBR (which has no capacity marked on it) only to go on to suggest that I could easily ride a larger bike like a middleweight.... I didn't have the heart to tell him that 1, he was looking at a 500 and 2, I'd just sold my GPz900!

Confession time... I quite like to let plastic missile riders through in traffic or on really twisty roads and then just follow them, a safe distance but close and sitting bolt upright (so it looks like I'm not trying). I then just stay with them as they get quicker and quicker trying to lose the "slow" bike behind them... just to see at what point they start to get ragged and untidy you understand ;)

It's probably destroying my karma and I'll have a terrible next life :/ but hey ho, it's fun watching their preconceptions crumble :)

Richard 003

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2006, 10:09:09 PM »
Some interesting replies here. Anyone who knows me will know that I'm not a biking fascist, far from it. What does annoy me though is people who are happy to 'wear' a biking persona without having any desire to fully engage in the lifestyle.

Er, which lifestyle? Find half a dozen "bikers" and ask them what "the" biker lifestyle is, and you'll get six different replies. Some patch club types, for example, seem to think that anyone in leather and a cut-off is trying to emulate their "lifestyle". I'll talk to anyone who enjoys riding a bike, and I'm sure you do the same too :-) 

xbruby

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Re: Start the week topic
« Reply #14 on: December 07, 2006, 01:53:27 PM »
Interesting debate as usual.

I don't think it really matters what you ride, when or how, what differentiates the weekend warrior or the 'wheel in the air' stunt jockey from what I would term a 'motorcycle enthusiast' is the inability to like all types of motorcycle and all things motorcycling.

I love motorcycles and all things motorcycling, I am not prejudiced for or against any particular type of motorcycle or motorcyclist. I work on my own bikes and I also have work undertaken on them by others as required.

When I first started riding back in the mid 70's there was a real sense of universal brotherhood amongst motorcyclists, it mattered not what you rode but simply that you did. I remember well my plastic maggot catching fire on a motorway in Holland in 1979 and a kindly Dutch Ducati Dharma rider pulling up to help me. He couldn't speak English and I sure as hell couldn't speak Flemish but he spent half a day getting me off the motorway, taking me to a Honda dealer and making sure my bike was fixed before he left me. That event left a lasting impression on me and to me my Dutch friend personified the true meaning of a real biker - comradeerie, friendhip and mutual understanding and enthusiasm.

If I was at the side of the road these days I am not so sure I would get the same degree of help but I nevertheless try to respect all bikers as fellow two wheel enthusiast regardless of what they ride or whether they service their own machines.

Andy

PS - some bikes (e.g. the latest Gold Wing) are certainly not for the DIY maintenance enthusiast but I don't believe that makes the owners/riders any less of a biker.