Thumper Club Forum
Technical => Project Progress => Topic started by: guest1130 on August 09, 2010, 12:51:29 PM
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Hello everyone, new to the forums and new to bikes ;D !
First off, I'd like to do a bit of an introduction of myself, so you'll know what youre dealing with here. I'm a Finnish bloke closing in on my 30's (tho I like to think of it as mid/late 20's), been studying for the majority of my life and am now more than halfway through my machinery studies at the University of Oulu. I've always been into cars, and back in -02 or -03 (can't recall the exact year right now) I bought my first project, an -88 Toyota Supra. That car turned out to be a bit of a rust bucket, and I had no idea of what I was doing so the inital conditions of this project were far from ideal. The car was broken all the time so I had to learn to fix it. I also bought a second car (-88 Volvo 340 ;D) as a winter beater, which was also broken all the time, so I had to toggle between the two, getting one to run in order to fix the other.. I did a lot of mistakes with those cars but also learned a lot!! Sadly, the end of the Supra came as a broken crank bearing just as I was about to start my university studies. As you know studying is a time of poverty, so I had to sell the baby to a fellow Supraclub member as it was, and took a real beating with the price. I've been studying for 3 years now, not really having a project vehicle (except for the overall maintenance of my current daily driver), but doing all sorts of mechanical and electrical stuff as a hobby.
On to bikes..
I've had a bike-fever every summer since I was 16, but never found a good enough excuse to actually buy one. This summer the fever was too overwhelming, and I started to gather justifications to proof myself I really need a bike:
1. I need a project for the winter, or I'll go mad.
2. Bikes are cheaper and smaller than cars
3. I really really want one!
(the text editor is going weird on me so I'll continue with a reply...)
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(continued)
So I started to dig into the world of motorcycles. For me it was clear from the beginning that this bike was going to be customized - for me, building is more than half the fun. Before really learning about bikes I had never heard of a café racer before, and became fascinated by the stripped down, sleek look of these bikes, and the pure functionality of their designs. So then it was off to searching for the right bike to start with. I first thought of some classic british bikes, but those were too hard to find/expensive here in Finland, so I chose to look at Japanese bikes. At first there were a few alternatives - a couple of Honda CB's and a suzuki GS. But then.. out of the blue this bike shows up for sale:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/03082010042.jpg)
It's a -90 XBR with 67k km's on it - a rare find since these were never imported to Finland (as far as I know only three exsist here). I immediately saw the potential of a café racer look on this frame and also the price was right, so a deal was made. I haven't actually seen the bike, just pictures, but it's a runner.
The bike is located in southern Finland, and I currently live in north so I'll be able to pick it up at the end of this month, when my summerjob ends. I don't have a licence to drive it yet, and I plan not to get it this summer, so I'll prolly just take a quick test drive on it to see if there are any obvious faults, and then start tearing it apart.
I have very ambitious visions about this bike, so hopefully I'll obtain/learn the skills to make it look and perform just the way I want it to.
I'm really glad I found this forum since it seems that there's a lot of knowledge regarding the XBR here, which hopefully will be very useful to a newbie like myself. Hopefully this will be a start to a great and fun project!
And please, bare with me with my posts, english isn't my native language
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Welcome Kaff.
Firstly please do not apologise for your English. It is considerably better than a lot of members on this site. Try asking any of us to post in Finnish.
XBR'S make fine cafe racers. Look up Hurleys efforts on this site and you will see what I mean.
Again welcome and please keep us updated.
Rob.
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Hello Kaff
Welcome indeed! If you can't find what you need about XBR's here then it probably doesn't exist any where else.
Strangely I was only talking to a work colleague this morning about how I would like to visit Scandinavia again. My last visit was to Norway in 2007 and I would like to visit both Sweden and Finland next time, probably in 2011. Why not organise a Finnish Singles Rally so I have a genuine excuse? Not that I really need one.
Good Luck with your project, and keep firing those questions in during the long winter restoration.............
Boyd
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Thanks for the welcomings RobG and mini-thumper!
I had already read through Hurleys amazing XBR project before I joined - that was the thread that made me find this community. I'll be thrilled if my project will be anywhere near as high quality as Hurleys, tho mine won't be quite as "racey" as his. My vision for this bike is to simplify and lighten it to the max, and get an almost "street fighter'ish", rugged look with no chrome, just matt colours and machined surfaces.. I will be picking up this bike on the 29th of august, so hopefully a real update will be available then.
As for the Finnish singles meet, I might ask around on local forums if there are thumper enthusiasts here, as said, I'm new to this scene so as of yet I don't have any knowledge on the Finnish biking scene.
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My vision for this bike is to simplify and lighten it to the max, and get an almost "street fighter'ish", rugged look with no chrome, just matt colours and machined surfaces..
You could name your bike "Matt Finnish"
As for the Finnish singles meet, I might ask around on local forums if there are thumper enthusiasts here, as said, I'm new to this scene so as of yet I don't have any knowledge on the Finnish biking scene.
Excellent............not saying "No!" is nearly a Yes.
Boyd
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So, I already have a few questions, which might help me with locating spareparts for this bike. Since the XBR 500 was never imported to FIN, you can imagine that spareparts are hard to find locally. So here goes:
- Which hondas have the same engine / transmission?
- Where could I find good (read: cheap) EU webshops that sell spares for this bike?
Also, I'm curious about the wheels, what are the widest wheels that can be fitted to stock alloy rims? I've also been thinking about upgrading the wheels, rims and brakes, would like a disk brake to the rear as well. Has anyone fitted SRX rims onto XBR? Or any other bikes rims for that matter?
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All the RFVC motors are very similar, shouldn't be a problem to install a motor from any of the aircooled XR's up to 650, or a Dominator lump.
Have you thought of taking the complete front end from another bike? That's often easier than making a wheel fit and making brackets for calipèrs etc., usually the only detail work is to match the new stem to the old headstock. Might be worthwhile looking at a full rear end swap too: swingarm, brake, wheel... perhaps front and back ends could come from a later 250 sports bike?
Once you start to change a bike the options are endless ;D
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Very true, the options are infact endless. But, before cutting and slicing, there are a few things to know about the Finnish policy with bikes:
There's a quite strict policy here in Finland concerning the street legity of modified bikes. On the other hand we have the advantage of having no annual MOT's.. So if the bike purchased is already registered (which mine is) AND stock - there's no need to ever do MOT's again. The catch here obviously is that if/when modified the bike should be taken to MOT to pass the modifications, which can be tricky.
Modifications regarding suspension and hence forks always require a special "handling test" (it's referred in the Finnish biking scene as "kopterisääntö" - a sort of curseword amongst bikers) here in Finland. There are two companies that qualify doing the test here and the test costs 500€ ... So I think you understand why I'm quite reluctant to modify the forks.
My option one with this bike is to build it - keeping in mind that IF the coppers stop me and demand my bike to go through MOT, it will pass without a question. I might even do the MOT without demanding. Option two is to build it, ride it, stay quiet about the modifications and hope that nobody (cops) notices..
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I live in Spain, we have an annual Tech. Inspection for older bikes (every 2 years for bikes less than 10 yo). Strange thing is that the only detail listed on the bike docs is tyre sizes!
So I've made many changes to my bike, an SLR650 (will soon post pics of finished article), b will have to use the original wheels for the ITV but take my chances with the 17 inchers I use for the other 364 days.
Fortunately the cops and Guardia are laid back in the Axarquia, only bother folks who are seriously taking the p**s. 8)
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Hey all, not much of an update on the XBR but a motorcycle related purchase. After countless hours in different motorcyclegearshops I ended up with an Arai Chaser (http://www.araihelmet-europe.com/2009/eng/index.php?page=chaser) in pearl black finish as my helmet. I tried on at least 25 different helmets from various manufacturers but nothing fit me nearly as good as the Arai. It's not the cheapest brand, but it is from the budget end of their collection. I initially thought about buying an open-face helmet to support the cafe-racer look, but for safetys (and/or my gf's opinions regarding safety) sake I chose to go full-face.
Not ridden with it yet, since I haven't even seen my bike yet, so can't really comment on noise levels or stuff like that, but I must say it's VERY comfortable, cool looking and has neat features like the protecTint pinlock visor (that I got for free :D) that automatically turns to dark smoke when under UV-light and otherwise stays clear.
As for REAL bike updates, I'll be going on a well deserved week's holiday to Turkey on the 1st of september, and will pick up the bike after that, so stay tuned.
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Good helmet the Chaser, though mine is coming up for replacement. 3 years and 50,000 miles and despite being washed many times it is humming a little...
(http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l230/phatphord/bikes/helmet.jpg)
Look forward to more on the bike.
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Hi, I'm back from my holiday and tomorrow, I'll get the bike back home where it'll be torn to bits :D. I haven't ridden it yet, but I have started it on the trailer and had a closer look of the overall shape the bike is in. The engine runs OK, no weird noises or anything, but the exhaustpipes leak quite a bit (which really doesn't concern me much). The electricity of this bike is a mess; the previous owner had started to replace all indicators with smaller LED ones, but had not finished the job. The indicators are there, but they haven't been connected to anything. Headlight works at both HI and LO beam, the taillight works and the instrument lights seem to work ok. The horn, indicators and the brakelight don't work. There's also lots of different kinds of post-factory electrical joints on the wiring loom (some of them don't seem too safe..), but, I'm not worried about that either since all the electricity will be renewed.
It's obvious that the bike has been tipped over at some point, since the cluch lever has been straghtened by hand (poorly) and the left haldlebar seems to have bend a little also. The frame is in "ok" shape - a bit of rust here and there, but nothing dramatic. The tank, fender and sidepods have been resprayed but the tank seems to be rust-free from the inside. Center-stand is rusted and broken and the wheels are done.
Overall, it's everything I expected and paid for. A really nice billet for a café racer.
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Hi Kaff.
Whats the mileage on your new bike ?
& if not TOO cheeky , what sort of price did you pay for it ???
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Hi Kaff.
Whats the mileage on your new bike ?
& if not TOO cheeky , what sort of price did you pay for it ???
Hi Fuzz!
no secret - as stated before the bike has around 67 000 km's (~42k miles) on it and I paid 1000€ (~£820) for it.
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Update time!
Firstly, I finally had a chance to take the XBR for a test drive and man do I love this bike!! Tho at 80MPH it may not be the easiest bike to handle, but I was looking for a city bike and a bike for some backroad fun and thats exactly what I got!
Then on to the build - it's teardown time!
This is where I started:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1011.jpg)
As I said before the electrics are a mess:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1013.jpg)
Calling this a rat's nest is polite...
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1014.jpg)
But I'm not that concerned about the electrics, what I am concerned about is the face that it seems this bike has suffered a bit more serious crash than I expected.. See how this turn controller has bent:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1015.jpg)
Also there's something wrong with the front forks.. either the pipes, triangle pieces, the axle or the lower fork bars have bent seriously. I didn't notice this while driving, but look at how off the front wheel is in relation to the forks:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1020.jpg)
I couldn't tell what it is just by looking at it, have you guys seen anything like this before and do you know what could cause this?
Anyway, it's late and this is how the bike sits now:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1021.jpg)
I'll post more tomorrow
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Stand at the front of the bike , wheel in between your knees.
Hold the handlebars & TWIST straight, same as you did with your bicycle when you were younger !
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Stand at the front of the bike , wheel in between your knees.
Hold the handlebars & TWIST straight, same as you did with your bicycle when you were younger !
...not sure if this was ment to be a joke, but if not, what do I need to loosen before doing this? I mean, if both triangle pieces (not sure what theyre really called) are true, then tightening them should keep the fork pipes straight, right? And if the forkpipes are straight, but the wheel between them is not, then the axle must be bent (right?).
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Hi Kaff,
I had the same problem with my SLR, everything looked ok until the first 10metres of the test ride, got a price reduction... ;)
When I stripped everything, the forks were straight, the alloy top yoke (triangle/triple tree) was OK but the steel bottom yoke and the spindle were both bent; replaced for 25quids.
Hopefully your fork legs and frame are ok.
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...not sure if this was ment to be a joke, but if not, what do I need to loosen before doing this? I mean, if both triangle pieces (not sure what theyre really called) are true, then tightening them should keep the fork pipes straight, right? And if the forkpipes are straight, but the wheel between them is not, then the axle must be bent (right?).
[/quote]
I wouldnt joke about that !!
The triangle bits ( Top & bottom yoke....)
They can be left as it is.
All that has happened is that the forks have twisted in the yokes , they will twist back...
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"All that has happened is that the forks have twisted in the yokes , they will twist back..."
Unlikely with the damage to the lock-stop but...
Kaff: loosen off the bottom yoke bolts, hold the wheel between your knees and try to force the bars into the right position, if you have no damage it'll all stay like that.
Otherwise its time to check the fork stanchions, bottom yoke and spindle for true; its unlikely that the alloy sliders and top yoke will be bent. Worthwhile to check the steering bearings and wheel bearings for damage and wear at the same time. :(
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I did loosen the bottom yoke bolts, as I took the horn mounting plate off. I tried twisting the wheel in it's right position, with the bottom yoke both loose and tight, but it wouldn't budge. The top yoke is untouched.
Anyways, as this is a "lets-do-it-right-the-first-time"-project, I will take the front forks to bits, check for straightness and wear, and replace if nessessary. I'll leave the front end alone for a while, cause I wan't to keep the bike on its wheels for as long as I can, and I'll start to tear the rear end apart now.
On a side note to more knowledgeable people:
I'm having real difficulties finding used spares for this bike - €bay only shows 38 items regarding Honda XBR. My question is how interchangeable are parts (mainly interested in forks etc.) from a GB 500 to an XBR 500 - the bikes look awsomely alike...
EDIT: Also, if anyone has a picture of the lock-stop plate in original condition, please PM or post here - I think I need to make a new one and weld it to the frame before powder coat..
Back to the garage -->
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Teardown, day two:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1030.jpg)
I had some good progress today, but I'm now almost at the point where taking the bike off it's wheels becomes mandatory. Most of the parts, that I've taken off the bike will never get on it again. And I'm also furious to Honda engineers for the amount of brackets and clips on the frame, tho I know they all have a purpose on a stock bike. I'm going to attack it with an angle grinder as soon as I'm done with the teardown. The idea is to simplify as much as possible. I'm spending a lot of time just standing beside the bike and just looking at it, trying to figure out which brackets are useful and which are only in the way. The bike will have custom seat so I'll need to locate where the seat can be attached to. I'm also gonna do a tiny rear chop, hopefully won't kill the bike with the grinder... (I have a feeling I'll be in trouble with this later on..)
I'm still having doubts wether the frame is straight or not, can't tell by looking at it but the more I get into it, I see little knacks and scratches that indicate a serious crash..
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Take the fork brace off and then loosen both top and bottom yoke clamp bolts (not too much or the front end will drop) then twist it back straight. You should be able to see if the lock stops are damaged, mine got bashed in by a tank slapper at Snetterton years ago.
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Teardown - day 3
I've made quite a lot progress today, I've stripped down almost the whole frame. Just the center stand and yokes are still there. Tomorrow I'll take out my trusty angle grinder and start slicing and dicing. Some pics from today, all the yellow/green taped bits will be removed:
Wiring loom:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1037.jpg)
Stage 1:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1033.jpg)
Stage 2:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1039.jpg)
Stage 3:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1044.jpg)
Engine happily off:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1042.jpg)
The engine was a real pain to take off, until I decided to ignore the factory repair manuals advice to "remove the engine from the LEFT side" and took it out from the right... I also have a question. Is the ignition swich supposed to be permanently attached to the top yoke or is it supposed to be removable by two screws? If it's supposed to be removable, then both my screws are broken, I could only see stubs between the ignition switch and the yoke.
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You've met the usual overengineered-fit-for-any-bike-lots-of-brackets-and-miles-of-unnecessary-wiring Japanese bike.
If you really want a lightweight one person bike then a 30kg reduction in weight is very possible and the cheapest way to improve the power to weight ratio and the fun per kms too ;D
Weight reduction beats engine tuning.... cheaper and more reliable ;)
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If you really want a lightweight one person bike then a 30kg reduction in weight is very possible and the cheapest way to improve the power to weight ratio and the fun per kms too ;D
Weight reduction beats engine tuning.... cheaper and more reliable ;)
I'm with you on that - tho I'm not trying to build the fastest XBR - just more simple and goodlooking. And this bike will remain a two-seater as the missus might feel the need to hop on for a ride (on the bike ;)), but the seat will be far from the original one, I'll return to that somewhere in the future.
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Teardown - day 4
This is the part where all hard-core restorers need to close their eyes, time for some grinding.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1048.jpg)
Nothing dramatic happened, don't worry, just a minor rear chop and some bracket removing. Still needs to be sanded more before blasting and paint.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1050.jpg)
One XBR to go:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1053.jpg)
I came across a weird offset metal plate on the front of the steering stem attached to the stem with 2 studs and I have no idea what it's for - can I scrap it?
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Sounds like a horn bracket, but I've not got an XBR....
Trevor
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Sounds like a horn bracket
Good guess, but the XBR horns are lower. This looks more like a guide of some sorts, it is shaped as a curve to match the steering stem, but is not aligned to the center but rather to the left side of the stem. It has some randomly shaped overhangs and one hole (with no thread) and it is attatched to the stem by two studs (can't tell if theyre threaded, tried turning them, but I can't get a good enough grip). My first guess was that it's some kind of a steering lock, as it's located under the ignition switch and is shaped so randomly..
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So, today I had a chance to prepare the frame ready for powder coating. The lock stop is now fixed, I used the old bent one, straightened it and added some more material by welding to get the correct shape. Then covered all the sensitive places and sandblasted the frame.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1074.jpg)
After the sandblasting I noticed that the frame was cracked! The left bottom tube was cracked almost all the way around just next to the seam. Patched that up and then the final blast.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1057.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1060.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1065.jpg)
Freshly sandblasted XBR frame - A new start for this bike:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1072.jpg)
My best friend TJV, who's in my opinion the best mechanic around, and has helped me a LOT with various projects, including this one.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1069.jpg)
A nice little detail, got the model plate off pretty intact and it will be a nice touch on the finished bike.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1077.jpg)
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I´m enjoying this one... completely blank canvas to start on 8)
Have you decided on colours yet?
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Have you decided on colours yet?
This bike is going to be black. The frame will be powdercoated to semi-gloss black, and I'm not sure wether the rest of the parts that will be painted will be matt or glossy black (I'm tipping towards matt).
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You gotta go matt! Remember what I said previously about a suitable name - 'Matt Finnish' ;D
Boyd
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While waiting for my frame to come back from the powdercoaters, I took some time to clean the VERY oxidised and dirty engine. A brass brush, some steel wool and and a lot of elbowgrease later, the valve cover and head are a bit tidier:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1078.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1084.jpg)
I also took the electric start off, to see a bit how the engine would look without it. Initially removing it was in the plan to save weight and also to get a tiny battery. The real dilemma with removing the starter lies in wether to chop the crankcase cover, since there's no need for the starter overhang. However, if the cover is chopped, it also needs to be welded because of the hole for the sprocket to witch the starter takes on. Also it excludes the option to fit the starter back on... I really can't decide right now.
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Go on, chop it, you know you really want to 8) 8) 8)
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The frame came back from the powdercoater, the colour is semi-gloss black and I love it. A few really hard-to-get-to places were a bit unpainted, I'll haveto get some paint to them using a fine brush later. Overall, I'm really happy with the result. Tomorrow I'll move most of the bike to my place for re-assembly.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1090.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1096.jpg)
Oh, and did I mention that I'm going to do the reassembly in my tiny third floor studio apartment :D ? I don't know if I'll take it apart again and do the final reassembly somewhere else or if I'll do it all the way in my apartment and get some friends to help me carry this 150kg bike three stories down ...
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While waiting for my frame to come back from the powdercoaters, I took some time to clean the VERY oxidised and dirty engine. A brass brush, some steel wool and and a lot of elbowgrease later, the valve cover and head are a bit tidier:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1078.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1084.jpg)
I also took the electric start off, to see a bit how the engine would look without it. Initially removing it was in the plan to save weight and also to get a tiny battery. The real dilemma with removing the starter lies in wether to chop the crankcase cover, since there's no need for the starter overhang. However, if the cover is chopped, it also needs to be welded because of the hole for the sprocket to witch the starter takes on. Also it excludes the option to fit the starter back on... I really can't decide right now.
You could try using the XL600 generator cover and clutch cable assembly as the crank cases are the same.
http://docs.google.com/viewer?
a=v&q=cache:OBp1VBlCt70J:www.hondaxl.it/download/Manuali/XL600R_honda/part_05.pdf+honda+xl600+generator+cover&hl=en&gl=uk&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESj_c5NJRpSeh5X9kltPiWY7dEz9HblIW75RcCxTY4F87QdGwpDrBYJ7EOscAcpVz3rXEzW_EKeBD_6A4D0YxpNGNRsLaaXk9cLtsPMKQ4w_zzeoT0WEAmGANEU8M-cLLwu7lPCI&sig=AHIEtbR4-EKE7gRusNvUpxadiy7KgBvF0w
(http://i954.photobucket.com/albums/ae28/pmhclassics/DSC02681.jpg)
or make up a blanking plate like mine:
(http://i954.photobucket.com/albums/ae28/pmhclassics/XBR500/DSC01636.jpg)
inner cover has blanks turned and glued into place:
(http://i954.photobucket.com/albums/ae28/pmhclassics/DSC03141.jpg)
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turkeyuk :
Do you know if the XR series kickstart only covers will fit: they look the same :)
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Thanks for the info on the XL600 covers, turkeyuk, would be cool to fit one, if I could find one.. Fleabay offered one, but posted here it would be around 70-80€ so I think I'll make some blanking plates instead.
The project is now moved to my place, but I haven't been able to do much, because of schoolwork. I've painted the pale spots from the frame and cleaned some of the rear fork parts:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1105.jpg)
The chain slider was a real pain to get clean, and it's also pretty worn, but will haveto do. BTW, do you guys know any good ways to "revive" rubber parts?
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Im not sure about the XR cover but it looks the same.
Ive vapour blasted all my rubber parts to get them clean, when you mean revive do you mean flexible again or just looking new?
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when you mean revive do you mean flexible again or just looking new?
Well, both I guess.
I just did a f**k up worth mentioning, I was installing the in-good-shape-had-a-REALLY-hard-time-taking-them-out-in-one-piece rear fork bushings back into their places. As I was HAMMERING (!!!) the first one in, and whaddyaknow, the hammer slipped and took a really nice chunk off the bushing.
Just kill me, please.
I'm gonna go and try to drown myself in a drinking glass.
If that fails, I may need to fabricate one new bushing, since these are not found in Finland, and I hardly see myself ordering one stupid bushing overseas.
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ooooh bu**er, turn some out of nylon on a lathe ;)
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Thanks for the info on the XL600 covers, turkeyuk, would be cool to fit one, if I could find one.. Fleabay offered one, but posted here it would be around 70-80€ so I think I'll make some blanking plates instead.
The XL600 covers are also magnesium so they are a little bit lighter as well as having 'magnesium' cast into them them for added bling.
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Hi Kaff, if you can find out the dimensions for the "offending" bush, I may be able to make one out of some nylon I have lying around. PM me
HTH
Ian :)
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Hi Kaff, if you can find out the dimensions for the "offending" bush, I may be able to make one out of some nylon I have lying around. PM me
I appreciate the offer, Ian, but I think I'll be able to do one myself. I was even pondering, would it be better to make both bushings out of brass instead of nylon?
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Not much of an update, but today I managed to make a new bushing to replace the one I broke and also sandblasted the lower yoke. I couldn't get the lower ball race off the yoke, so I had to cover it using duct tape.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1106.jpg)
I also got the ignition switch off the top yoke for a thorough cleaning for both parts. Also, the rear fork is pretty much done and re-united with the frame:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1108.jpg)
"I like my bikes like I like my dogs, black, fast and hungry"
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"I like my bikes like I like my dogs, black, fast and hungry"
I'm a cat lover: like my bikes lean and mean with a bad attitude 8)
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"I like my bikes like I like my dogs, black, fast and hungry"
I'm a cat lover: like my bikes lean and mean with a bad attitude 8)
Feck, I wish I wasn't a donkey lover.
Mark
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Not much has happened this weekend, and to be honest, it's kinda bugging me.. As I'm building this bike in my apartment, I look at it all the time, and I hate when there's no progress.
The reason there's no progress is that I can't paint here. The other reason is that I have a crazy idea about what to do with all the alloy parts, but I can't make that happen just yet.
Anyways, here's one forkleg disassemblied. Someone has previously been here, since the oil seal had been shredded with snapring pliers, and the snapring was missing. The copper bushing showed copper from each side, hence according to the manual, it's time for a change. I still think the bushing is good to go, I'll just replace the oilseals and the dustseals.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1118.jpg)
Does anyone have an opinion about WeMoto.com? I was thinking about ordering the seals from there.
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Wemoto are OK....
I fitted a set of Ariete seals last week on an XBR500 in work , & I found them to be FAR superior..
I FULLY recommend this make...
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400152539701&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400152539701&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT)
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I measured the left fork tube for straightness and it checked out. 0.045 mm bend, which is still way within the service limit of 0.2 mm. I also cleaned the chain, since I'm not going to replace it nor the sprockets.
And here's a nice little tool me and a friend at school made; it's a socket for tightening the steering bearings to their correct torque. It might be a bit too robust for such small amount of torque, but it'll do the job.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1122.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1123.jpg)
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Did U check the bottom yoke? Soft steel, mine was bent (SLR650)
Whats the plan with the fork sliders... polish or paint?
I tried paint. Alloy polishing is easier and lasts longer. :)
Last incarnation of my bike was satin black and silver.
Next will be gloss black and polished bare metals, partly 'cos of low maintenace.
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Did U check the bottom yoke? Soft steel, mine was bent (SLR650)
Whats the plan with the fork sliders... polish or paint?
I tried paint. Alloy polishing is easier and lasts longer. :)
The bottom yoke looked ok, I didn't make exact measurements, but compared it to the top yoke and all holes were more or less on the same locations :D
as for the fork sliders, I think I'll polish them - for now ;) .
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"I like my bikes like I like my dogs, black, fast and hungry"
I'm a cat lover: like my bikes lean and mean with a bad attitude 8)
Feck, I wish I wasn't a donkey lover.Mark
A big part of this Mark is taking that first step. Now you are no longer in denial, this can be improved.
Very brave, well done.
Rub.
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I just came by to let you guys know that I'm not dead and neither is the XBR project. I've been busy with school and life in general for the past month so not much done to the bike. And frankly, I've had a bit of a motivation problem with the build, since I've now started to work on the alloy parts and we all know how fun polishing alloy is.
I also recieved my new fork oilseals from wemoto along with some other parts, so the fork assembly is a go as soon as all the alloy parts look nice.
Some update: got the headrace bearings in place:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1134.jpg)
And here's the top yoke done. I know it's not totally mirror, but close enough.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1148.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1151.jpg)
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Hey guys, it's been a while.
First off - tho I havent posted in a loooong time, the project is still on. I've been busy with my studies for the last few weeks and fell into a deep demotivational bender with the bike. But now I'm starting to pick it up again (don't hold your breath, it's still going to progress slowly).
I needed to take the front end back off, because I couldn't help but look at it and think to myself "somethings definately wrong", and something was. It appears both my yokes are a bit twisted, hence forcing the wheel to steer right. As they are alloy and soft cast iron - there's just no way to make them 100% straight once bent. So I did the next best thing. I twisted them back "straitish" by hand. Tho I'm sure they arent 100% straight, theyre close and I'm going to roll with this and see how the bike steers. If the steering is still sh*t, then I'll find replacements for them.
Here's a pic of some freshly blasted/polished 25 year old parts:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1213.jpg)
The fork braces and the rear sprocket will be painted black using just plain aerosole. The front disk will get some heat resistant black on it. The polished fork tube is a disaster - I don't like the look and hence didn't bother being too picky with the end result, but now I need to polish the other one too. I might end up painting them next year. The headlight brackets turned out beautiful - I shortened them about 20-30mm to get the headlight tucked a bit more closer to the forks and also drilled holes for the LED front blinkers.
It feels good to be working with the bike again - hopefully I'll get a bit more done this spring. To be continued.
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So.. only a day has passed since my new found inspiration and boy has that day been dark.
First: The top yoke is cracked. It didn't handle my attempts to try to straighten it. I've already posted a wanted add for it.
Second: I tried to re-assembly my left fork. I couldn't get the oil seal to settle properly (or rather the bushing under it), so I decided to take it apart once more. So I start undoing the bottom bolt which is attached to the piston and the bolt starts turning and turning, but didn't come undone... it turns out the piston is turning with the bolt. No matter how hard I put pressure on the spring to get the piston "stuck" so the bolt would come off, I've had zero luck... so the freshly polished fork leg might have become a pretty accessory to my garage..
If all else fails... I'll drill it out and try to find a replacement...
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An old trick is to jam a broom handle down the inside if the leg to stop the damper tube turning. The SRX has a hexagonal recess on the damper rod, which can used to stop it turning, does the XBR have anything similiar ?.
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The SRX has a hexagonal recess on the damper rod, which can used to stop it turning, does the XBR have anything similiar ?.
Negative. It's round.
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Having taken several makes of forks apart and come across this problem you've got, an answer I've used is, providing the fork is assembled with the spring putting a degree of downward pressure on the damper, is, and this sounds very crude, to insert the 'Allen' key into the bottom bolt and then strike it in the 'unscrewing' direction with something along the lines of a scrap pair of pliers. This does sound a bit daft but there's a reason for using some relatively 'light' means of force and the reason is 'speed', if something heavier such as a hammer is used it'll give the damper time to move with the bolt and nothing will be achieved. A friend of mine re-assembled a Marzocchi fork and foolishly used threadlock on this damper bolt and then decided he wasn't happy with the job and wanted to dis-assemble again and this method I've put forward worked on getting the bolt back out notwithstanding the threadlock. Another method I've heard of but never tried is to use an electric drill with a reverse facility to hold the 'Allen' key and give it quick bursts of power and see what happens !......................let us know how you get on !.
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A crude way is to do as Dick says, but use an electric drill, in reverse, with an allen key, set on "hammer" and press very hard before firing... poor man's heavy impact driver ;)
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If you use a drill with an adjustable clutch then you can set it to just bite and jolt the allen key in exactly the same way as an impact driver.
damhikijkok ;)
GC
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A small update.
I managed to separate the forkleg by using an impact gun on the bottom bolt. I've re-assemblied them both with fresh oilseals, copperwashers and fluids.
As previously stated, my top yoke cracked during straightening. My mate TJV (who's a genius when it comes to welding aluminum) and I originally thought about fixing the crack by welding, but the idea was scrapped due to the difficult spot of the crack and possible thermal disformation. Luckily I found a replacement for it on fleabay, which I'm currently waiting for. A few pics of the crack:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1224.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1225.jpg)
I've also done a lot of painting – nothing fancy, just basic stuff using aerosols. Here a few blasted bits ready for paint:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1222.jpg)
The front brake caliper was in bad shape. The slide had totally rusted in and I'm betting the caliper hasn't worked properly for some time. Also the slide boots were totally shot. Pics:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1217.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1218.jpg)
Since all the other seals were in great condition, I decided to test how it works by using merely o-rings instead of the slide boots. Of course this leaves the slide totally exposed, but rust won't be an issue no more as I made a new one from stainless steel. Also new Kyoto pads installed. Pics:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1231.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1232.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1235.jpg)
My new tires arrived too. I got Pirelli Sport Demons and stuck with the recommended dimensions. Now I just need to clean the rims and have these installed and balanced.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1230.jpg)
To be continued..
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Flying on, good effort
GC
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A quick update on the project:
- Rims cleaned, balanced and new wheels fitted on.
- Front forks assembled, the new top yoke installed and basically the whole front fork is pretty much done.
- Rear brake and sprocket in place and rear wheel in position for a quick mockup.
- Tank thrown in place for the mockup
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/XBR_mockup_side.png)
I've set up the front fork the same way Hurley did, the fork tubes are up an extra 10mm and handles reversed and switched left to right. The setup does suite me well since I have quite long arms, however there's only about 15mm space between the bars and tank when turned fully - a problem in case of a crash since thumbs will get stuck in between. Also, note that the rear shocks are not in place, and the rearwheel will get a bit more up.
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This is more like a tutorial than an update on the project. This is NOT the only way to do this, and the finished product might not meet everyones expectations, it's just the way I did it.
Tutorial: restoring old plastic handle bar switch assembly
As the roads are melting FAST here, I've started to feel a bit too anxious to just slap the bike together, so I can ride it soon. However, I've decided to stay strong, do the bike so it will please me in every way as soon as it's done, although it might take more time. As my front end is mechanically starting to be together, I dug up the handlebar switches, which were in bad shape:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1438.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/Before1.png)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/Before2.png)
The top part of the main bracket (if you will) was strangely pitted and lacking colour. It almost seemed as if someone had sandblasted it and painted it with a very thin cloack of grey paint with silver flakes in it. The texture was really rough as the picture of the run/off-button shows. The bottom part was okay though. My concluson was that this is the result of plastic being exposed to UV-rays for 25 years. The problem is merely cosmetic but it still bothered be enough to start thinking about how to revive it. The obvious choise would be to paint it, but since I'm usually against painting for surfaces that don't need it I decided to try and polish it - after all, the part is made out of one piece of some sort of black composite.
So I started by cross sanding it under water (with a bit of soap in it). I started off with 400 grit followed by 500, 600, 800, 1000, 1200, 1500 and finally 2000 grit.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1456.jpg)
after 400 grit
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1457.jpg)
after 800 grit
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1458.jpg)
after 1200 grit
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1459.jpg)
after 2000 grit
People are always scared of going into this because they think it will take forever, but in fact, if you gradually go through as many grits as I did, the only part that takes more than 10 minutes is the first one. The first 400 grit pass is critical, you need to remove as much material as needed in order to make a smooth surface for the following grit, which will only even out the scratches made by the previous grit. In this case, I needed to re-do the whole procedure as I didn't sand deep enough with the 400 grit the first time. This piece of plastic was pitted HEAVILY.
Then I took out my dremel-tool with a self-made "buffing wheel". This was essentially made using small pieces of an old 100% cotton t-shirt pressed together.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1465.jpg)
The reason I needed to make my own buffing wheel is that dremel has very high RPM's and the felt buffer that came with the set was too hard and started to melt the plastic.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1462.jpg)
After dry buffing with dremel
The results could have been better if I had used a buffing compound with the final buff, but I didn't have any at hand. Also waxing the part might bring it to a more glossy surface but over all, I'm pretty happy with the final product - It looks a bit weird on the above photo under direct sunlight, but it's actually pretty close to the finish of the bottom part. I did the same treatment with the run/stop-button:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1466.jpg)
I love the fact that there's no paint on it - to me, it brings a certain "truth" to the part.
The internal components will be cleaned (the conductive surfaces sanded clean and all the springs will get fresh grease). Obviously this procedure removed the lettering from the part, but they can be applied later if needed. This one might get away without them since run/off reads on the button and the starter button will be disabled, so that leaves only the light switch unmarked and I think I can remember what it does ;).
Until next time.
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Some update.
As I was assembling the brake master cylinder, I noticed that the sight glass had seen better days (in short, you couldn't see s**t through it) so I decided it needs a replacement. I took out the old one which literally crumbled when given a little pressure using only a fingertip. I also noticed how thin it was and decided the new one needs to be thicker, so I dug out everything I could from the hole to get to bare aluminum walls. Here's what came out:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/Old_sight_glass_1.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/Old_sight_glass_2.jpg)
I turned a new glass on a lathe from a polycarbonate staff. It's 6mm thick and well polished so good visibility and durability in one package. I made an O-ring groove to the side of the glass, then made a REALLY tight fit with an O-ring to keep the glass from leaking. Alas, I have no idea about how polycarbonate reacts with brake fluid, but I guess we'll find out soon ;) .
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1480.jpg)
This is a random snapshot to show the love I'm giving to parts that don't show outside, a freshly painted gauge bracket with treated rubber parts (btw, I use Korrek SiliconeStick to all my old rubber parts - it really revives them):
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1485.jpg)
I also was so pumped on the look the handlebar switch got after polishing, so I figured I'd try the same procedure with my headlight dome. The hard part was to sand it all the way down to bare plastic, after that it was just going through grits and polishing. I love the semi-gloss almost charcoal black finish that it now has. Might use a coat or two of wax just to protect it from UV-rays:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/Headlight_dome_1.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1484.jpg)
The rear shocks were totally functional, but I didn't like the look they had - the black on the shocks themselves had chipped here and there and the chrome-painted springs had partially given way to rust. So I took them apart, sand blasted and painted the shock and the spring. I also got new bushings to each end as the old ones were a bit streched and loose. The preload adjuster and the top mountring got polished with a buffing wheel. The black plastic shield (?) still needs some work in order to compliment the other parts. My only worry right now is will the paint stay on the springs as they need to be compressed hard for assembly. I know you can get paint made specifically for springs but, well, I'm broke and impatient so we'll see how they turn out.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/Restored_rear_shock.jpg)
To be continued.
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wow kaff your really putting some hard work in on your xbr nice job looking foward to the seeing it finished where did you get the bushes for the shocks i could do with some off those..............tommy
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Thanks tommy, I'm really looking forward to seeing (the day) it('s) finished as well. :D Hopefully I'll be able to take her out at least for a while next summer.
The bushes I ordered through my local Honda dealer, so I guess just go to your local Honda shop and order them in? Theyre genuine Honda spareparts.
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Bit more progress..
I assembled the rear shocks and, to my surprise, the paint on the springs didn't chip off! I had a difficult time finding a suitable spring compressor for the rear springs, so I made one. It's pretty ghetto but functional. The ghetto-compressor at work and the final product:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1498.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1552.jpg)
My headlight was mounted with standard M10 nuts, which needed to be held in place when tightening the headlight or aligning it. I saw this as a problem since when doing vertical alignment of the headlight the sidebolts need to be loosened and tightened and with the current setup, it's impossible without removing the headlight from the dome. I noticed there were grooves inside the headlight dome, probably for some kind of mount nuts - so I made alloy nuts to match:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1495.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1496.jpg)
I've also spent days trying to figure out the electrics as many of you might have noticed from the problems section. I've started to draw myself a completely new wiring loom - my goal is to eliminate as much wire as possible and also keep the whole wirind diagram more simple.
A part of this idealism led to designing an "electricnest", if you will. This under the seat box is supposed to house the CDI-unit, brake- and taillight sensor, turn signal relay, fusebox and the battery. The first incarnation of this is born in 1mm thick stainless steel sheetmetal, I cut the baseplate in form, drilled the holes for mountpoints and such and then folded it into shape. As you probably can guess, the holes were a bit off after folding, so next time - drill AFTER folding if possible. Then I welded the sidewalls on. You have to excuse my welds - it's been a while since I've TIG-welded anything. Let this part be a reminder to all that welding is a skill that needs to be trained constantly.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1554.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1551.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1555.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1556.jpg)
I'm not really happy with this - it's a bit heavy (well.. not really but yes compared to aluminum or composites) and not very pretty. My other concern with it is since I scrapped the idea of using a LiFePO4 battery due to compatibility issues with the alternator and their tendency to.. erm.. spontaneously burst into flames, I've yet to find a lead-acid or gel battery that fits in the box properly. I found one, but it's only 1,2Ah. Do you guys think I could pull a 1,2Ah rated battery with no electric start and mainly LED lights?
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Hey guys, thought I'd shed some light on my projects current status. I've been working in a different city for 1,5 months now, so I've gotten to work on the bike quite seldom. However some progress has been made: I'm almost done with my driving school so pretty soon I can legally drive a motorcycle. Sadly the XBR is in no condition to be driven. Here's the little that I've managed to do:
The front of the bike is almost done. I wasn't happy with how the stock clip-ons looked and feeled as they were, and I didn't like the stock look either. So I ordered a pair of fully adjustable Tommaselli clip-ons to get the stance I wanted. I've set them up with a fairly steep 17 degrees angle, but it looks and feels right. I've also obtained some bar end mirrors to finish the café look on the front. The front electrics are 90% done, I managed to get the original gauges lit up completely using LED's. How she sits now:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1562.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1563.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1564.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1566.jpg)
I also made a "ground bar" to the headlight dome to uncomplicate the wiring loom.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/PICT1567.jpg)
Hopefully the bike will be up and running in some condition during this season.
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You are doing one fab job considering your circumstances. Keep it up and keep the progress reports coming
Ian :)
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A small battery will not do the job. Starting a 500 single takes a lot of current. And if you do get it started the regulator will see low voltage and supply enough juice to recharge a normal-sized battery or fry a little one. Strangely enough, the people who designed that bike knew what they were doing.
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How do you recon the starting amperes would be more than what is needed while running? The spark is no different and the only thing cranking the engine is my foot.
EDIT: only problem I see is the regulator overheating and breaking down. A functional regulator/rectifier will not force feed amperes to anything.
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Just a quick update: I got my drivers licence yesterday!! So now I'm REALLY anxious to get this bike on the road, one way or another :)
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Well done mate! ;D
Feels good huh??!
Now get it finshed and ride it!!
andy
(great thread by the way, looks great)
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- a small update -
With my current work assignment keeping me busy and apart from my bike in another city, the bike is progressing slowly. I'm so driven to make this bike run soon that I've decided to concentrate on the details next summer and just get the bike on the road ASAP.
As of yesterday, the bike is a roller!
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/PICT1588.jpg)
I've decided to use the old seat for now, I hate the way it looks but it'll have to do for this season. Almost everything is on the bike besides the engine, exhaust pipes and some tubing.
I've also fabricated a quick temporary bracket to mount my new LED taillight, indicators and license plate to the old XBR seat. It looks... hasty, but it should do the job. It will be attached to the seat by using rivet nuts - as soon as I can find a rivet nut gun that handles metric 8mm threads..
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/Temp_taillight_assembly.png)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/temp_taillight_assembly_2.png)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/PICT1583.jpg)
The regulator/rectifier is turned upside down and oriented so the wind will pass in between them better.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/PICT1574.jpg)
The wiring loom didn't turn out as good as I'd hoped. The reason being my anxiousness getting the best of me and also I made a few mistakes on my wiring diagram. But the good news is, everything mostly works! Mostly being, the taillight warning light won't turn off although the tail light works fine. It was this way also when I bought the bike. Don't know if the brake and taillight sensor is faulty, is there something wrong with the loom or if the sensor just doesn't work with LED. Either way, it's no biggie. I also had to give up the rear brake light switch. I had a relly nice bracket made for it but the oil tank blocked the direct route to the pedal, so that'll mote to the to-do-list.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/PICT1575.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/PICT1577.jpg)
I ghetto-mounted the oil tank using just regular steel band you'd find on any hardware store. It's ugly, but does it's job.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/PICT1579.jpg)
Here's a quick teaser pic on what I'm going to do with the exhaust next winter:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/PICT1590.jpg)
I'm planning on fabricating a 2-to-1 all stainless free flowing exhaust on the bike. I measured the diameter of the exhaust ports on the engine (30mm) and am going to use the same inner diameter on the header pipes (ID 29,7mm), which will then unite in to a 2" single tube, followed by a 2" free flowing muffler. It will be short compact and noisy but that project will have to wait until next season.
I'm planning on reuniting the engine to the chassis next weekend and who knows, I might actually get her running for the first time in a year!
Until next time.
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Great to see some progress on this kaff :)
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Boy, what a day!
Yesterday I worked from 10pm to 6am, then drove 150km's back to my home, to work on my bike. Me and a friend spent the whole day from 10am to 11pm working on the XBR. We had some success, but also a few failures.
The bike is now complete with motor, seat, tank, electrics, tubing and exhaust. In other words, the bike is ALMOST ready to hit the tarmac. Almost - I had completely ignored one of the most important things with the build.. Everything was going smoothly, all the electrics were done, all tubing in place and motor mounted I started to route the clutch cable.. "Hmm, it's weird, I have no idea where the cable mounts to - there seems to be no bracket for it.." Thats because the bike no longer has an electric start and the clutch cable is mounted on ..? Thats right - on the side of the starter motor.. So now the bike is almost roadworthy - only thing thats missing is the clutch :D
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I had the starter motor sent to me yesterday and finally got a chance to ride the thing! It was a blast, I just need to do some adjusting to the pedals and handles to make the bike more suitable for my riding position.
It did die on me a few times - each time was at traffic lights when loosening the throttle and stopping. This sounds like an idle issue.. I also had some trouble figuring out the tubing on the carb, could someone help me find out what they are?
1. on the bottom is the drain tube, that one is certain
2. On the left side, just above the bowl is the main fuel feed-line, also pretty certain
3. On the left hand side there are two more that I can't figure out. One near the manifold and one near the throttle opening. Could someone tell me what these are for and where do they go?
4. On the top of the intake manifold is the first end of the air cutoff valve tube right?
5. On the right side is the other end of the air cutoff valve tube.
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Here a few quick photos of the first reincarnation of my XBR - it's not completed, but driveable.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/version2o0.png)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/version2o0_2.png)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/version2o0_1.png)
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like it.
like it a lot :)
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Okay, about 100km's on the bike (mostly city traffinc) and some first impressions:
I'm not comfortable driving this bike as it is. Firs off, I'm having idling issues. The bike stalls most of the time if I let go of the throttle on crossroads - today it even stalled in my driveway although the engine was hot. This might be caused by the free flowing air-filter I have on now - I haven't adjusted the carb in any ways (figured I need to do it again soon after my pipes are done), so thats I minor issue.
What I'm most concerned of is the fact that the bike does not feel stable - even in speeds below 80km/h the bike feels "wiggly" and as I let go of the handlebars, it starts to slightly pull to the right. Now there could be number of reasons this is happening, but I'm always suspecting the worse - bent frame or forks. I still need to have a closer look to make sure the rear wheel is aligned perfectly straight and that the forks are evenly adjusted and tight - other than that I fear I might need to tear this bike open again next winter.
Any other suggestions I need to do to make the bike more stable?
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Steering head bearings too tight will have that effect, try loosening and see what happens.
Just a thought.
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The 'die at the crossroads' feature is common with this engine. Beneath the carb should be a hidden screw that adjusts idle mixture. You may need to make a special tool to adjust it: a small cross-head screwdriver bit fitted with something that will allow you to turn it. Turn the adjuster 1/4 turn in and see what effect that has. If it's worse, turn it the other way. On some bikes this screw is capped to prevent owners from attaining satisfaction, as the bike was never intended to be easy. Remove or drill out the cap.
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I use a screwdriver bit jammed into a piece of rubber tube. There's just about enough room to get your hand in and turn it. The manual suggests starting at 2 1/2 turns out and working from there. I can't remember whether it's in or out for richer or leaner :-\
It's worth checking the o-ring on that mixture screw too.
Dave B
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Hey guys!
Been a bit under the radar for the past.. err.. year and a half... but my bike's not gone nor am I so here's a little update on what's up!
Firstly, I rode the s*it out of the trusty XBR last summer, tho the weather in northern Finland wasn't all that great. I haven't done anything to the bike since I last posted, just been riding it! My university studies are on the finish line and me and the ms are going to move to southern Finland this may. I'll hopefully find a job right away, so I can afford to be a bike enthusiast once again.
Some of the things I did on the bike were great, some weren't. Basically what happened was I didn't have the money or the tools to make a proper restoration so I feel like I need to take it apart soon and do it all over again.
- Some of the bolts have started to rust badly .. should've figured that out when I was cleaning them with wire brush (d'oh)
- The engine needs to be blasted and painted - anything short of that is just not good enough. I have this beautiful frame in which I put half a*sed parts on.. not cool
- I have all the parts for my 2-1 stainless super short exhaust pipe, just need a few days off, some metal working tools and a TIG welder to make it. Next summer perhaps..?
- I've started to make a fiberglass custom seat mold for the bike, now it just needs (a ton of) filler and sanding so I can make a proper seat form the mold. Right now it's -12*C outside and I don't think the ms would appreciate me sanding down a block of fiberglass in our livingroom.. so that'll have to wait a bit as well
There's just a few examples of what need to be done. Basically what I'd REALLY need is a second bike so I can properly work on the XBR without the urge to ride it. Hopefully I'll get there some day soon.
I'll try to get some updates for you for the next season
Cheers - Kaff
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Aye Kaff,
Riding the beastie is what it is all about. ;D Delighted to read that's what you've been up to. Not so cold here but getting a Polar wind, Force 8 at times and frequent snow showers during the day. Starlit night tonight, but been in the workshop rebuilding brake calipers! Not my favourite job, but necessary with all the salt we get thrown on the roads here. No spiked tyres for us! ::)
Good health for 2013 to you and the Ms. :)
Regards, Bill.
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So, I took the XBR for a first ride this season and it was a blast!
My plans for this summer are
- make a new exhaust on the bike
- change a few bolts (that weren't nickel plated and are now rusty (`doh!))
- get a new air-filter
- re-jet the carb
- change the chain gear ratio a bit to get the RPM's a bit lower on cruise-speeds
- get a new chain
- try to finish a new seat on the bike
The seat I'm working on is going to be fiberglass based with a space for a small bag where the standard "cafe-racer-seat-hump" would be. My experience with fiberglass is VERY limited so this is a trial-and-error process for me. First, I made a crude prototype by laminating fiberglass straight on the bike. Next step is to even out the prototype with filler and LOADS of sanding. Then, laminate a fiberglass mold on top of the prototype. And lastly, laminate the final seat inside the mold - the final product should be light, fit the frame perfectly and require minimal sanding/filling before paint. Right now I'm at "crude prototype"-stage:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/WP_000068_zps9e5779ed.jpg)
Question:
If someone has a standard XBR-carb off the bike, could you measure the outer diameter of the inlet tube? This so I know which K&N filter to order.
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Project: exhaust.
This morning I woke up at 7 and took an 80 km ride on the XBR to a friend's garage to start making the custom exhaust on the bike. The plan was to get the pipe tacked together and finish off the welds later. We ended up finishing the system in a single day - a bit unpolished but functional. My friend TJV is an excellent welder and my role was his handyman, involved in the grindings, fittings and planning - the project was a success thanks to him.
The basic idea was to make a short, 2-in-1 all stainless all free flowing exhaust. I had previously turned two stainless header outlets on the lathe and acquired a miscellaneous selection of stainless pipes, cones and angles. The muffler I bought was a 2" free flowing car muffler, so it was expected to be loud. Here's where we started:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/IMG_0276_zps163697ed.jpg)
First we made the header section, which was to be connected to the muffler via v-band because I wanted the option to easily change the muffler without taking the whole system off the bike. The header section consisted of two 29,7 mm inner diameter tubes that would join together into a 2" diameter single tube. The tricky part was to make the diameter transition seamless for best flow characteristics. We ended up doing the 2-in-1 piece using stainless cones.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/IMG_0277_zps257dab22.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/IMG_0278_zps831c8ec7.jpg)
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/IMG_0279_zps87ec5a5f.jpg)
The muffler section has .. well .. the muffler with a short outlet angle on one end and a v-band flange on the other. Tightened everything up and fired the bike up. It was awesome. But LOUD - the "muffler" is a completely free flowing 2" pipe with limited noise insulation . My friend fabricated a removable inner tube inside the muffler to help reduce some of the noise and also create a little back pressure which made the exhaust sound a little more neighborhood friendly - don't get me wrong, it's still loud. The end result:
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/IMG_0281_zpsd111e536.jpg)
I'm loving the compact look of the system, it totally changed the whole appearance of the bike. The new system weighs way less than the original too, which is always a good thing. I have yet to decide wether to polish the pipes, wrap 'em in some black Thermo-Tec or sand-blast and paint them black. Time will tell. After riding the XBR back from the garage, the header section has a golden color due to heat - it looks pretty cool, would look way cooler if it was polished. The bike is considerably louder and probably in need of re-jetting but all in all, I'm super happy with the exhaust.
(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a211/Jaypeesupra/XBR/IMG_0284_zpsf5a018f6.jpg)
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Nice set of down pipes, they should flow well
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F*** OFF TRANSLA!!!!
Plus 1
Don't get it? (maybe a brit thing?)
Aaanyhows, the bike is now resting at my sisters garage for the winter. It has new additions: a fist size dent in the gas tank, a broken mirror and a cracked speedometer case .. A dude tipped it over with his car while parking.. still waiting for the insurance amount.
I've also started to look at other bikes. I've really started riding more and am looking for a more comfortable, reliable and overall more carefree motorcycle experience.. The bike has had a ton of problems during this summer, electrical and mechanical (all my fault since I've put it together :) ), and my current address doesn't support my need to fix the bike every weekend.
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F*** OFF TRANSLA!!!!
Plus 1
Don't get it? (maybe a brit thing?)
It was in response to a spam post which has been removed
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Hey guys, been a while.
I'm sad to report that the XBR has been sold to a new home :'( . I found myself out of time or the means to keep maintaining and improving the bike the way it deserved. I feel like the project got about halfway through (well.. they never truly get finished, do they?), and I think it has a great base for its next incarnation. The guy who bought the bike has been racing Honda XL / XR-bikes for ages and knows the technique of the XBR by heart. He is planning on taking the bike to a more "Street tracker" direction, which I kind of like! Anyways, I feel sad to let it go.
I'm not going to stop the hobby, but rather move on to riding instead of maintenance, due to my current situation in life. I'm looking for a bit more modern naked bike with a lot of torque to blast through city traffic. I'm currently eyeballing Buell XB9S 's, Ducati Monsters and Triumph Street Triples.
Thanks to everyone who supported me with my first bike, it will be missed!
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Buy another thumper. Modern sports bikes have no soul.
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That's a shame, I enjoyed reading your posts. Will the new owner be joining the forum?
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That's a shame, I enjoyed reading your posts. Will the new owner be joining the forum?
Not sure, I told him this is the place to look for advice on an XBR.. It would be great to see the direction he takes it tho, so hopefully he'll keep a diary about it somewhere.
As for my next bike, I've been looking for all kinds of alternatives and right now I'm most drawn to a brand spankin' new Yamaha MT-07. But we'll see..
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Hello all experts ;)
I am a new owner of Kaff's XBR and will continue the project to the little bit different direction. I am used to keep some kind of diary of my projects, so it would be a good idea to keep it in here...
My background with motorbikes is quite long... Most of the days I drive enduro as my main hobby and also participate national competitions when ever I have change. Current bike is KTM XC250 2013 with all fine tunes for rocks and mud. I also make some booring helmet cam videos of my stuff and those can be found from here: www.youtube.com/ylisuutari
I have made so many project that it is quite hard to even count those all. I work mainly with computers and that is the reason why have continous need to mess my mahds with oil and dirt... I also have some kind of a need to see the results of my work... I think you all know what I mean :)
Here are few of my projects I have done during past years:
- rebuild crashed buell cityX (bike was not an oldie but it was so fun to ride, policeman has different opinion about that)
- Ducati monster 600ss 1995 totally rebuild
- Honda XL600R 1985 restoration (got familiar with the RFVC engine at this point)
- Honda VR750 Magna (partly rebuild)
- H-D Sportster Evo with small frame mods and engine work
- maby half a dozen different kind of dirt bikes (some of those turned to supermoto and also driven SM)
Also owned some bikes without any specific building... like CBR1000Fireblade, CX550C, CBR600R
About XBR. It is very nice to continue from this point when almost all "dirty" works are already done. Most propably I will take closer look to the engine as well and make sure everything is as it should.
I also have couple of questions to get my project started:
- Dirt tracker style needs more rough tires... plan is to put there Brigestone TW42 or pirelly scoprpio A/T wheels. My question is, how big tires can be fitted? How about if I put 120/90 to the both ends or should I go with something like 140/80 to rear and 120/80 to the front. I hope someone have experience about this. I would not like to order a new tires and after that notice that those will not fit.
- Cas tank and seat will be changed to the smaller one. Seat will be self made, but any suggestions what tank can be easily fitted? I have in mynd Harley XR750 Flat track tank but it can be difficult to find with reasonable prize. Other options is to go with old XL125 tank (must be really old one). I would prefer tank to be as small as possible can be easilly fitted.
More pictures and stories will follow..
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I hope your project goes well. I too have an XBR that I am planning on doing 'something different' with, but I don't know what just yet.
I have been riding motorcycles since I was 16, and I'm now nearly 62. Of all the machines I have owned, the XBR has given me the most pleasure, not just riding, but tinkering as well.
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I'll be following this closely!! - changed the title to a more appropriate one ;) .
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Hello,
So, today I finally got the bike to my carage. After about two hours it looks like this ;)
Front fork needs new seals.. little bit problems with opening bottom bolts, but I will find out something tomorrow. Do someone know it there is a similar seals and dust covers in another Honda models? Need to find parts from Finnland.
I have one very tricky question... is it possible to change gear map? On XBR gear pedal is heading to back and if I make a flat tracker, I must turn it heading to front. After that whole gear map will be opposite.. one up and all down.
If someone needs XBR original tank and seat, please let me know.
Attachment Expired
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On my old race bike I fabricated a linkage to correct the gear pattern after I fitted rearsets. If I can find it I'll take some pictures, otherwise its possible to use XL600 parts in the gearbox.
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Hi again. Short update.
Front forks dissambled to peaces. Oil was like old, dirty, black water :o
I am an offroad dude and normally I will change front fork oils after 20h of hard racing. At this forum we are not talking about offroad bikes but please remember to change fork oils at least once a year. After oil looses all lubrication features, there is only metal against metal. I still need to check all tolerances and I hope that this fork will still work. At this case I know that Kaff has changed oils but I think there was water also mixed to the oil. There was an oil leak on pipes so that might be the reason.
I managed to find a beautifull new tank for the bike. Need to be fitted but not very hard job to complete. Totally original Kawasaki retro tank from '70 which I found from local junk yard for 50€!!
I think the tank is taken from Kawasaki KH125.
Old Pirelli sport diamod tires will be removed today from the rims. I will polish outer rims and new Pirelli Scorpio MT90 A/T tires will be installed after huge amount of autosol and polishing.
My very first idea was to pulver coat rims to black, but when I saw all bolts, nuts etc. details I decided just to polish them partly. Powder coating is not an option at this case. We will see how it will look... need to find black spoked wheels if result is not as goos as I expect.
Rhinoman: Please send pictures from your linkage if possible. Most propably I will need to relocate footpegs.
Attachment Expired
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Hmm... wheels seems to be anodized, so must stay as is, no polishing.
Anyone have spoked wheels, I could be insterested to buy ;)
Next thing is the handlebar... Need to hunt suitable risers.
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Hi again,
Short update as promised ;D
Front fork re-assembled with new oil and dust seals. No damages found what so ever and eveything seems to work fine in there.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Rpv10M4w4DI/UznOgzl19eI/AAAAAAAAAF4/vIkAE3195_s/w587-h440-no/Haarukka.jpg)
New tank sits now quite nicely and only small things to do with it. Tank cap found from local Harley store and fueltap is from KTM.
Wheels arrived today and now the look is more rough, I think.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/--etyXutsM-U/UznOiiqOjKI/AAAAAAAAAGA/8fTDM5G3HQs/w783-h587-no/vaihe2.jpg)
Currently I am working with the seat. Need to find correct shape. Not sure if I will use old ducktale and re-design it... already bought peace of leather for the seat.
Not sure yet where I hould put license plate. It can act like rear fender or other option is to put it on the side, but then I will need separate fender... hmm.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-MynEKVKKQOk/UznOkDMB-XI/AAAAAAAAAGI/P1KqPAw955A/w783-h587-no/vaihe1.jpg)
Engine is still un-touched, but will propably open it partly soon.
Kaff's muffler will most propably stay even if the original plan was to use side muffler.
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Man I'm glad I sold this bike to you! It's nice knowing that it's in good hands, and I love the direction you're taking it to!
You probably noticed while taking the muffler out, that there is a detachable damper-pipe within the muffler (just pull it out after taking the muffler off of the header). We put it there to reduce some of the harshness from the sound of the open muffler, but it's still pretty loud..
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Hi again...
Thank's Kaff. As I mentioned earlier, it is quite nice to work with the project where all dirty works are already done ;D
I already found damper pipe which migt me good to leave there because of the sound. It is definately loud enough even if it is intalled 8)
Updates:
Tank is now in right place and mounting is also there. Still thinking about paintjob... it is fully original 197x Kawasaki KH125 tank with exellent painting. From my perspective it would feel like crime to spoil it. We'll see what kind intentity crisis it will cause if there is Kawasaki mark in the tank :P
Propably it will not start with that tank ;D
Yesterday also started to modify seat etc. back of the bike. I noticed that small angle grinder is the best tool to shape the seat.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/N807DlwZ3iVHWdhWPL_BWg2VihlrZds4aAS_fNtY-Q=w165-h219-p-no)
Old duck tale will get a new shape and will be builded as a part of the seat. It is still too high in the picture, but it will gile you some king of idea what is happening.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/Taq_7r8YflfVp9ofNfedq0h1uBLP4YWcYLi0EY0gmQ=w293-h219-p-no)
About handlebar and footpegs: I turned cafe racer clipons upside down and mounted those to the top end of the fork pipes. Drilling holes to the upper yoke for risers is not an option because it is way too thin for it. Riding position is now really good and relax.. no need to move foodpegs... at least for now.
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About handlebar and footpegs: I turned cafe racer clipons upside down and mounted those to the top end of the fork pipes. Drilling holes to the upper yoke for risers is not an option because it is way too thin for it.
Another tip: Those Tomaselli clip-ons came with extra angle pieces, which you'll find from the spare parts bin I sent you ;). When installed, those will give you extra options on the height and angle of the handlebars.
(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa296/bgfootball6778/73%20CB%20750%20Cafe/11-29-07AdjustableClip-Ons.jpg)
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Whow! This is a very nice tip, thx.
I found extra peces from the box you sent. I actually tried to separate clip-ons earlier to change angle, but it was jammed too tightly. So... I need to use more force for it :o
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The linkage that I made was rather crude, just made from bits that were lying around, I made some hanger plates from ally and used ally pegs with the one on the left hand side turned down for the linkage to pivot on.
(http://www.rhinoman.org/bikes/xbr_lever_1.jpg)
(http://www.rhinoman.org/bikes/xbr_lever_2.jpg)
(http://www.rhinoman.org/bikes/xbr_lever_3.jpg)
I don't recall what bike the splined part come from - it may have been an old CB900 linkage. The part the rubber fits on is an old SS50 rocker shaft, the rest was old bits of tube. The threaded parts came from some old rearsets. If you're keeping the stock footrests then you would need a different pivot. It may give you some ideas for something nicer looking anyway.
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Hi again,
Thx Rhinoman for the pictures. I need to make proper, a bit longer, test run to figure out more about riding position. And yeah... already driven about 1km with it :)
What has been done during cuple of days:
- valves are now tuned. Exhaust valves was too tight and that was most propably reason why warm startup was a little bit hard.
- Duck tale and seat modified. Undertow manufactured from 2,5mm aluminium as well as license plate holder. Duck tale Filled with urethane foam.
- New rear blinkers intalled and new rear wires without any abico connectors.
Today seat cover will be installed and small tuning with the tank. After that we are ready for longer test run ;D
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/ZXpRRcf91k6sOaOC3B5SW3Jzr32ugbgX1pNVUm_1zoE=w911-h527-no)
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Looks great.
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Ok... now it is done so far. The first a little bit longer trip done and damn this bike is fun to ride ;D
I really like the look of the bike and it was quite funny how much attention this bike caused during the trip. Few prople even come and ask what is this awesome machine ::)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ZKBei1DNuW0/U072_32WKrI/AAAAAAAAAJQ/b01nZ3FJCps/w979-h734-no/valmis1.jpg)
It might be that footpegs need to be relocated but first I would like to ride with it a little bit more.
One question: I do not know jetting of the bike, but Kaff told me that nothing has been done after open pipe and air filter change. Any succestions, what main and iddle jet I should put there?
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^Any progress on this?
I'm still waiting for my new bike, so my season hasn't even started yet.
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No progress except driving :)
Actually handlebar is now much better with extra angle pieces Kaff mentioned (not in the picture).
I need to do somethig for echaust.. it is too loud especially when output pipe is not in the back of the bike.
Most propably I will try to find XR600 exhaust and modify that one... we'll see. Electric start need to be fixed with new battery of course, beause my wife can not start the bike with kickstart.
Clutch is slippering a little... maby I need to change plates at some point... wheeling is not possible at this moment ;D
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^
I serviced the clutch not long before I put it to the garage last season and fitted heavy duty springs to help with the slipping. All the plates were within specs too.
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I used to have to replace clutches quite often, a modified XBR engine can have a lot more torque than stock. What oil are you using? is it a motorcycle oil? some car oils will cause problems with the clutch.
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And story will continue for this awesome bike :)
Bike is now back in Estonia (yes.. it come to finland from Estonia).
Famous RR driver Sami Penna bought the bike from me and took it to Pärnu.
Sami is nowadays teaching RR driving and working with his new project Motoranch.
http://www.pennaracing.com/
http://www.motoranch.ee/
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/10984218_10153550568134719_8431211396546146451_n.jpg?oh=0b2322d2c9df6440f5a8465c411cf0d4&oe=57E5285A)